COTA Austin: Tyler Reddick is now NASCARs best roa

Hi, welcome to the Ask for the NBSA podcast. I'm your host Nate Ryan here with my colleague from NASCAR Talk on NBC Sports.com, Dustin Long. We are talking virtually tonight, right after a very eventful race at Circuit of the Americas, where Tyler Reddick won his first race of the 2023 season, his fourth career Cup Series win, and his third on a road course, Dustin. He's got

Toyota today for 2311 racing, I mean, I know Chase Elliott is considered the best road course race in a NASCAR, and it's sort of still up for debate because he was out of this race, and we don't know when he's coming back, but obviously he's out right now with a broken leg. But to me right now, you can make the case that Tyler Reddick is the

best road course race in a NASCAR. I don't think there's any doubt about it. When you look at what Tyler Reddick has done with the Toyota to win like he did, look, I think you could say we probably had the best car all weekend. And when's the last time you could say that about a Toyota at a road course, you couldn't say that at all last

year. Toyota's were not very good on the road courses. I know Christopher Bell wanted the robo last year, but before then, Toyota's really struggled to have any consistency and to do anything. So to me, that was one of the interesting storylines going into this weekend is what how well Tyler Reddick would do and could he help lift Toyota up higher. I know, Tidegib's finished ninth, but

for the most part, I don't know if I saw as much of a carryover for what Tyler Reddick did to the other Toyota's. Maybe Christopher Bell a little bit until he got caught in stuff. So I think they're still an issue. I think they're still a concern in the Toyota camp. I think they still have to look at what Tyler's doing if there's some things that

he can do. I think Denny Hamlin made a comment this weekend and it co-ed a Tyler does things a lot differently. And so Denny's kind of having to relearn some things or adjust how he has to do it and attack in a road course. So the Tyler Reddick effect, I think, will be interesting to watch as you hit more road courses. Yeah, I don't think you

can argue that he's not the best road course racer right now in cup. Yeah, and you mentioned it, Dustin, the next highest finishing Toyota was tie Gibbs, Joe Gibbs racing Toyota, who was a top 10 finisher, did finish ninth, but Denny Hamlin set up before the race during the gridlock. He basically told Michael Walletrup, don't count me up for a win. I might try to run

at the front, but you're not gonna see me run for a win. And that's the narrative, certainly we heard last year. And it's interesting you point out that Hamlin said that about Reddick because that was what you were asking guys this week is how much can a guy who's as gifted as Tyler Reddick is on road courses, how much can that transfer to the cars? And

can he improve these cameras that were so weak last year on road courses admittedly weak to the point where David Wilson was saying, we've got a real problem here. I think what we saw today is, I mean, there's only so much to transfers, I guess, right? Because any Tyler Reddick was unbeatable under breaking. I can't remember an instance where I've seen a guy be so strong

in terms of just being able to outbreak anybody else at will, and it didn't seem like any other trade, a driver's cerebral to do that. So whatever he was doing, I guess, there's still to your point, like what Denny said, they're still figuring out how to put that in their cars. Here's where I think progress is made is that the Toyota struggled, the 45 group was

able to dial in the car to fit what Tyler needed. And I think that was one of the important things that guys talk to when I talk to this week is about impact he can have. As he knows that field he's looking for in a car, and he can say, look, this is what it's doing, this is the field I'm looking for, this isn't the field

we've got to figure things out. I think they had essentially the field from the whole weekend on for as fast as they were as well as he was able to attack the course and practice and especially qualifying. So now I think it's the rest of the Toyota's kind of catching up, it's again, it's one weekend. I think maybe they were able to pick up some stuff.

Again, he was one of the three guys that did the good your tire test. I think it's interesting. Again, you want some of your better ones doing the tire test. He wins, Kyle Busch did the tire test, finished a second, Austin Cindrick did the tire test, finished six. So the Toyota teams, the 2311 team, the 45 team had that opportunity to take those notes from that

January test session and build it into the car. Again, you still got to work with your driver. You got to fit with your driver style and maybe these drivers have to adjust because if Tyler's not up there, it's probably for the most part of Chevy train and it's Hendrick cars up there. And look, it probably would have been Chase Elliott as well. If the Chase had

been competing, it had Chase, Byron and Bowman racing up there at the front. So Toyotas are still a little bit behind. I think the Chevrolet is at least behind the Hendrick cars and probably the track house cars on this track other than Tyler Redick. And I still, so there's still more work to done. And obviously they've got time now. The next road courses until Sonoma in

June and then you start getting into a stretch of road course races. So that'll be a key stretch. What we'll see coming up after later in the summer. So Tyler Redick leads 41 of 75 laps. That was the most racer, 41. The next most laps were led by William Byron. He led 28 laps starting from the pole. Those also were the one two qualifiers. William Byron

on pole, Tyler Redick qualifying second. Certainly Dustin, those were the two dominant cars of the weekend. But I think what was interesting was the way the strategies were unfolding until, and we're going to get to it, a very chaotic finish. As we always come to expect on road courses, three green line checkers, we're going to get to that. But until that point, it was interesting that

Tyler Redick was essentially setting himself up his team, Krueger, Philly Scott. We're setting him up to run this race on three stops. Billy, are you planning on three stops the whole time? Or was that something where you didn't mean to get off strategy from everybody else? Yes, it was most likely. Three, not at those particular laps. So yeah, when the yellow come out early, obviously you

expect everybody else in a situation like that that's kind of on the fence to do the opposite of you when you've been a dominant carol weekend. And Kudos to Tyler for staying focused and dealing with, that was really the only chance. At one time, we were back in traffic and he dealt with it really well, made quick work of it, kept the car in one piece.

We still thought it was going to work out the best, even without the way the yellows felt. So we did that with the plan of two stopping from there, that still fell into the three stop strategy window. We had looked at in the beginning, untimely caution. Right outside the last field window that made it more of a close race than we were wanting. But we had

already got the lead at that point and fortunately able to race some heads up and he had speed. Whereas it seemed like going in Byron and a lot of other cars were going to be content with two stops. Tyler Reddick, I think, hit it on lap 13 from the lead when Byron, a lot of other lead lap cars, the contenders stayed out. So what did you

make of that does? I thought that was a really interesting move. That to me, signaled how confident 2311 racing felt about its driver that we're just going to put him on offense. We don't care if he has to make up the time or an extra pit stop with fresh tires and him being the best road course driver, maybe in the cup right now, we're going to

feel confident we can win this race. Yeah, I thought it was interesting because, like I said, he pitted lap 13. So look, if this was a, if this was a been the road course race from last year, lap 13 would have been the last opportunity to pit before they closed pit road for the end of the stage at lap 15. So basically, I almost felt like

they were running the race at the beginning just like they would have last year. And basically with the stage breaks and the cautions, if you think you've got a chance to win the race, you're going to give up stage points in the first stage. You're going to pit before the stage, before pit road closes, and then you're going to put yourself in position to get a

better track position, put yourself in position in the second stage, or you could even do it again in the second stage. I think when I went back and looked at the stats, nearly half the top 10 drivers in the sixth road course race is last year didn't even score points in either stage. So look, when you've got the best car, that's a play you can make.

Now the issue is, if you get a caution at the wrong time, then you get put in in a vulnerable position. We saw that in the extended race on Saturday with AJ Almond Dinger having a very strong car. Went out and pit. There was a caution shortly after then he had a couple restarts in the 20s and got beaten banged around. And almost thought maybe that

was going to be it for him before he came back and won that race. So there is a little bit of risk involved. Yeah, it makes a lot sense even though they sacrificed any stage points, stage one. They won stage two, so they pick up a playoff point. Now they were essentially locked in the playoffs because they win the race. But of course it was not

without drama, as I mentioned, you had three green white checkered finishes. And we saw this interesting situation Dustin where Reddit was missing it somehow in turn one. It wasn't I think until that second or last restart or maybe it was the third to last, the first green white checker where you finally kind of figured out how to nail it. But up until then I think it

was endowed. And I think the team was telling them on the radio, coaching him to change his marker as he entered turn one because he was doing something that was allowing Byron and some other guys to kind of get to his outside. Yeah, that was, and I was listening to him. And for the most part, William Byron throughout most of the race. And it was fascinating

hearing that conversation on the radio for Reddit asking his team about that. And just the struggles in turn because he was constantly missing that corner so much and drifting out so far wide that he was leaving the inside so far open that he was losing positions or having to battle while going through the S's. I know that's something he said in the press conference afterward that's

not the ideal situation because now you may get yourself in trouble with the track limits and cross it over the lines and being too far inside the S's and get penalized. So you get a sense of the mind of Tyler Reddit and they're talking about how much he works and how much time he puts in the simulator and how much effort he puts into. And he's

quizzing his guys, his team about, hey, what does it look like? What am I not doing? Because I know at one point on one of the restarts they said, look, you're making your move, your defensive move too late, you're making that move but then you're hitting the brakes as you're starting it as you're making your turn and that's throwing your car off. So make your defensive

move a little earlier before you get start turning the wheel and hitting the brakes and everything like that. So obviously that last one was he nailed it and did it well, got through turn one and turn two and after that was pretty much gone and as long as there were any more cautions it was his race to lose and he didn't. Yeah, and he closed it

out. That's really great insight Dustin. And kind of give us that window and what the team was coaching him through it. And I think there was a need for that reassurance because this season Tyler Reddix first with 2311 racing after being in the Cup Series the last three years of Richard's shoulders racing, becoming a winner there. But then having kind of an awkward transition out of

Richard's shoulders racing gets a 2311 racing, Kurt Busch on the race broadcast today for Fox. He of course has exited the number 45 seat because of the concussion that he suffered last year in the Pocano crash. So it moves on to 2311 racing, putting Tyler Reddix in that seat. And some expectations there Dustin certainly very high. There was a lot made when Tyler Reddix was hired

about they expected him to do some really big things right off the bat. Rob Tiansen from the podium finished.net. How validating is his victory knowing what you guys saw on Tyler Reddix long before he got to be in this number 45 ride with his circumstances, the running Kurt Busch? Yeah, I mean, it's why I went after him as early as I did. I just I didn't.

I wanted to get the jump on all the other teams because I knew he was going to be the most coveted free agent in a very, very, very, very long time. So that's why I got the jump on it. Now it cost me a lot of money to do it. But it pays dividends. You have to have that driver that you feel I can carry you

to championships and wins for decades. And I think that we have that guy. And it's not going to stop at road courses. He's got dirt racing, short tracks, speedways. He's just he's got what it takes on every race track we go to. The 2023 season didn't get off to a great start for Tyler Reddix. And Daytona 39th place finished a crash. Fontana 34th place finish and

a crash. He kind of turned it around Phoenix and Atlanta. He had top five the last two weeks. So perhaps he was building to this. But now that I was released in Kyle Petty actually said on the NASCAR MBC podcast. I think I'm motormiles as well a few weeks ago that Tyler Reddix was one of the drivers. Kyle Petty was most concerned about because he thought

Tyler Reddix might have been pressing a little bit in this new environment, in this high profile ride that he's now in driving for Danny Hamlin and Michael Jordan at 2311 racing. What's your opinion on that? You've talked to Tyler throughout the season. How do you think he's weathered this change? And how much of this win mean for him and his career? Well, it's not easy when

you leave a ride. And then the guy that comes in your car wins the second race out. And Kyle Bush nearly could have won the clash. And then his first race with that team. So the way Kyle Bush started off the season and the way things kind of start off for Tyler, I mean, again, that's whether that way to hold on on Tyler, he's not really

expressed that. But again, start off the season with a couple rough finishes. That's not what you want because you've got all this excitement going into a new season for any team. And it just kind of deflates everybody and just kind of how you get work through that. Now, obviously, look, Tyler's been through some challenges throughout his career, even in the experience of winning back-to-back championships. It

was a one-year-in-one junior motorsports. He struggled all season long. And all of a sudden, he came out and won and won at Miami. And it was like you wouldn't have expected it because of the way he struggled just to get into the playoffs and make it and go far in the playoffs. And all of a sudden, he was the champion. So certainly, now I know that

it was a perfect track for him. But he certainly showed his resolve and be able to fight through things that he needed to fight through to go and have a championship. And then again, he's a guy who goes to another team in the next season and wins the championship again with a second different team. So he's kind of gone through some of that, but then it's

when it's somebody else and you're in what had been your car winning races, winning a race, and then you struggling. It's a little bit challenging. As you're trying to learn all the new things at 2311, how Toyota does things and working through those issues. But he's got a really good head on his shoulders. And here's a guy who's under 30. And Danny Hamlin, when he signed

him last year, talked about him being a generational talent. You put every effort you can into getting this guy and it was a bold move by 2311 to sign him for the 2024 season because before all this Kyle Busch stuff, Tyler Rettick was supposed to be in the eight car this year. He wouldn't even supposed to be over 2311 yet. But when Kyle Busch became available,

it made it easy for Richard Childress to let Tyler go. Before then, he was just going to hold on to Tyler until something else happened. And then Kyle Busch falls into his lap. So you get an opportunity to get a two time champion, even for a guy who might be a generational talent with where Childress was, it was more important to get that two time champion

in that number eight car as soon as possible. Yeah, I'm glad you bring up the Kyle Busch point as well, Dustin, because yeah, Tyler Rettick's future here really was predicated on both of the Busch brothers, in a sense, in that you're right. 2311 racing announced the signing of Tyler Rettick for 2024 before Kurt Busch even had his crash at Poconos. So there were a lot of

things that had to happen, a lot of dominoes that had to fall in Kurt Busch's case, unfortunate ones that had to fall for Tyler Rettick to kind of arrive in this situation. And the Kyle Busch point you make is great, because I think that that did put more of a magnifying glass on Tyler Rettick that Kyle Busch steps into that car, wins at Fontana and the

second race of the season in the car that Tyler Rettick had been driving in the last couple of years. And Zach Kitanza Ready, our producer at NBC Sports, was at Coda today and he got this quote Kyle Busch. I got alongside Rettick there on that one restart into the S's and I could have forced the issue and pushed them off or whatever, but we ran each

other hard, we ran each other clean and gave each other room. So I'd respect the kid and he's been nothing but great to me. So I give him respect back and so we've had some good races between each other and they were really fast. I mean, they deserve to win. There's no sense in taking it from him. Interesting that Kyle Busch essentially would say, hey, I

wasn't gonna take this away from Tyler Rettick. I don't think Kyle Busch, we're gonna get to this in a minute, but I don't think Kyle Busch would be saying that about cross-chesting and probably some other drivers. But I think also because there hadn't been an issue or seemingly we haven't seen an issue between Tyler and Kyle Busch. For Kyle Busch to go out and turn Tyler

for the win a week after he talked about to us, the media, Atlanta, about the lack of respect in the garage and pleading for some help in that. Maybe in essence, suggesting NASCAR needs to step in more often. I think would have just been hypocritical. Now, if it's against, if it's with somebody that he's had an issue with or there's a history there, that's another thing,

but I'm not aware of a history between Tyler and Kyle. So Kyle just turns them, then everything he said last week is worthless in a sense because he's going against everything he said, unless he can further explain why he made those actions. And obviously, like Tyler said in the press conference, he said he felt like he hadn't had any issues with Kyle, they've raised clean, he

felt confident with him behind him on the restart as opposed to some of those others who had been behind him for some of those other late restart. So Kyle's got to win too. So this is race six, this is not race 25. This is race 25 and Kyle Bush has to win to get into playoffs. Well, everybody understands the gloves are going to come off more

and there's going to be more aggression. And if he can get to the back bumper, this is like a short track race, at least way to turn one is in some of these corners that you're going to put the bumper to him and if they can't control it, then so be it. That's on them is the way you look at it. I think that Tyler Reddick's

reputation is fairly pristine among his peers. And there were a lot of bent emotions after this race. We're going to get to all that. There were a lot of angry drivers. We're going to touch on that. But first I want to make two more points about the finish. I don't know if you got this, Dustin, but I was definitely feeling some Ned Jarrett 1993 Daytona 500

vibes towards the end of this race. Of course, that was the famous Daytona 500 Dale Jarrett's first win and Ned Jarrett's in the booth rooting him on. Kurt Bush, as I mentioned, was driving the 45 car. Until that coconut crash last year and he got emotional. It's amazing. 2311 and how fast we're growing and how much we're doing together. It's forward together on this program. And

it brings me a little bit to be choked up. I was hoping to be back in that car, but it's in good hands. And it's a great team and I love racing with those guys. I thought it was interesting that we were almost like watching Kurt Bush in real time, Dustin, kind of processed the emotions about his own career while watching the guy who has the

ride that he did last year. But Kurt obviously was extremely graceful about him. He was very respectful and nothing but great things to say was rooting for Tyler the whole way through the finish, understandable, which I thought made for great drama, great TV. But on the other hand, it was interesting that I think kind of watch Kurt process all that in real time. I think we

forget how important a lot of this, how important this is to these guys. And when you have something that you've spent your entire lifetime on and yes, Kurt was toward the latter part of his career. But when it's taken from you as opposed to you being able to go out in your own way, that there are those unresolved emotions. And maybe Kurt recognized it or maybe

even caught Kurt off guard is just how it impacted him. And maybe he thought he was kind of over it. But again, this was a guy who won, what was it? Last May, so less than a year ago, one at Kansas. And so he's been in that car. And I think in one sense, this is only the way the third, sixth race, in some sense, maybe

still sees it as part of his car, even though it's Tyler's car now. But to see it win, maybe it was as much an out of body experience to see that car, which he thinks he should be in. And it just probably adds to the frustration that he's not clear to be able to race yet if he wanted to race in anything. And I know Denny

said, look, whenever he's ready to go, we've got a car ready for him. And he'll be, he's with us. And he's always going to be with us. So I hope he gets well. And I frankly look forward to the day that Kurt Busch can get back into a cup race at some point. Yeah, hopefully he'll get to end it, like you said, on his own terms.

And maybe get one more shot running well in the Cup Series, maybe even getting a win. But yeah, third win for three drivers now in the 45 since that Kurt Busch victory last May. He also had Bubble Wallace win in the 45 at Kansas as well. And it was somewhat of a different situation with the number changing, but interesting that that number now has gone victory

lane three times in less than a year with three drivers. One other point I just want to ask you about, Dustin, I want to give NASCAR a ton of credit for doing away with yellows at stage breaks. That been talked about ad Donzium for years about do you need to have full course cautions at stage breaks on road courses? And NASCAR considered it, debated it, molded

it. And finally, this year decided, OK, starting this year, we're no longer going to stop the races under yellow when we reach the end of stages. We're just going to pay out the points and keep it green. I think that worked really well today. I think the next thing they need to look at is local yellows, because I think we saw today, particularly with the end

of this race, one, they need to look at local yellows. But two, if they're not going to look at local yellows, if we're on a green white checkered and the dominant car has one second lead and clearly is the winner of this race is the so-called right winner. And there's been an incident on the first lap of a green white checkered and it's put down to

breathe that's behind the leader. And the leader's not going to reach it before the finish line. I think I would be OK with them holding the yellow until they wave the white for the leader, then throw the yellow, the races essentially over every of these decisions are first. And then you get the debris, which is out of harm's way. Where do you stand on all that?

Local yellows and shouldn't ask our maybe look at officiating cautions a little bit differently in those types of situations? Well, I kind of thought about going into today is the idea of a local yellow, because you get a 3.41 mile course. If you have a caution, it makes for a long caution lap. And look, some of these cautions are only a few laps, but they essentially

were close to 20 minutes long. And is that the best interest of the sport? You're around the IndyCar circuit more than I am. I'm curious how they do in a sense. I know they have the local cautions. But part of the thing that NASCAR says they don't want safety officials, safety people out on a track where cars are going at even with the reduced speed. Obviously,

it works for IndyCar that they'll have equipment out there. They'll have cars out there. Now, I can think of a time or two where, again, it's an extreme case. But I think what was the Andredi's running in the back of a safety truck at Detroit one year. And I think maybe there's been a couple other instances or even some close calls. How does IndyCar do it?

Is it something that can be done? Because obviously, it's about the safety of the individuals. You don't want to be putting people in the harms way. And if there's a feeling you're going to be doing that, then I'm fine with the full course cautions. If there's a way to do it with local cautions, then I'd be more open at ID. And obviously, IndyCar seems to have

found a way to make it work. IndyCar and a few other series, I think, are figuring out how to make it work. And your points will take. And I mean, safety always is paramount as it should be and NASCAR and any other racing series. So I get that argument. But I just think your other point is very well taken. When you have a road course in

almost 3 1,5 miles long, I mean, it brought America, obviously, even longer. Once you start running one or two caution laps around there, it feels like an eternity. Just hope that's something that gets addressed. But let's move on to the good stuff. Emotions, angry drivers, which I know you and I both love, guys embracing the hate, as much as we are about peace and love in

the world. There's nothing like the end of an NASCAR road course race these days. Let's start with Daniel Sures was particularly angry after this race dust. And we saw a video on the cooldown lap entering the pits. He slams his teammate, Roch-Castain, out of the way. And then he bumps Bowman, Alex Bowman twice in the pits. Talk about safety, like with safety workers and fans and

people around. I mean, not immediately adjacent to the cars, but close enough that they could potentially be in harm's way. I think my first question would be, does NASCAR look at that? Would you expect that there could be a penalty coming from that? I would think they certainly look at it. Section 4.4.B of the Cup Rulebook says that they can, you know, an action that penalize

the drivers for, you know, making contact with another competitor on Pit Road in an intentional manner. If they feel like that's the case, which certainly seems like it was there, they can penalize in a lot of different ways. It can be a point penalty of 25 to 50 points for the driver and or the team owner. It can be a fine, and or a fine of

$50 to $100,000. That could even be a suspension, which I don't think this, I don't think this goes to that level. I think the question is, is it a fine, or is it some sort of point penalty type of thing? Because again, you need to address this. If you're NASCAR, but you also need to show the rest of the garage that don't get in the habit

of doing this, you're going to show your frustration, show it on the track, not on Pit Road, where there's people who could be innocent bystanders impacted by this. And look, NASCAR, as you know, they've taken that a lot, they've taken that very seriously about when things happen on Pit Road that you don't do it. And so it wouldn't surprise me if there's some sort of penalty

probably Tuesday for Suarez, for his actions after the race. So let's go back to why Daniel Suarez was so angry. And essentially, it was on the second, the last restart, the second, Green White checkered, we had a situation where Ross Chastain, probably running in like row five or so, he runs in the Alex Bowman. Row five, he runs in Alex Bowman. Bowman hits Suarez, who had

restarted in the top five and was on the inside. Bowman hits Suarez, Suarez gets sent, ends up finishing 27, goes pretty much the top five to it outside the top 25 in the closing elaps here. So I'll just run through with some of the post-race comments where again, thanks, Zach, Tans are ready for gathering these. Ross Chastain said, I got spun the restart, a couple of

re-starts before, and he got it later. I don't know. I didn't get mad when I got spun. I just try to get my car to start. It was in low-wheel protection mode. And it's like at the ECU cycle, I got going, and I never thought about it again. I don't understand how we can be so upset about crazy re-starts that we're doing. I tried to beat

up top and go down the outside, and got spun, I'm on the bottom, I got slammed into, and are you not entertained? Sorry, are you not entertained? Peek out and bomb the guy in front of you, the guy behind you does it to you. So what do you do there? It's not right. The way we race is embarrassing, and 12 girls were doing it. We be

yelling at them, but here we are saying it's the best thing in the world on TV. Ross Chastain and Game of Sforaz had a conversation post-race. Alex Bowman, after being ran by Sforaz, he talked to Sforaz, and they apparently just worked it out of me. I think Bowman said, go talk to your teammate. Yeah, it's pretty much exactly what he said. He was like, that guy

did it. So it seemed like Bowman, Sforaz was fine with Bowman, but Sforaz was not fine with Chastain. And the only thing I could really make up in their conversation was Chastain said something the effect of, don't be all high and mighty, is what he said to East Trackhouse Racing teammate, Game of Sforaz. Obviously we just heard those quotes from Chastain, he feels as if, hey,

this is part of the deal, man, just deal with it. What do you make of all the angst and animosity after this racing? Can Trackhouse Racing put it behind them? Yeah, I think they can. I guess my question is, what's the expectation for Ross Chastain? And look, he's on the inside of Row 5, he's starting ninth, Sforaz I think was fourth or so. Chastain's got, as

you said, Bowman in front of him, they're going to the inside of the corner, they're going far left. He's got Brisco behind him, whether there was contact or not, but certainly Chastain was pushing the limit. And Sforaz finds himself in the middle in essence. What's the expectation for Ross Chastain? Is he supposed to not make every effort possible to try to take the position? And he's

instead supposed to protect Sforaz and let Sforaz get OK and then get through that corner. Or is he supposed to go for it? Because he's got sponsors and his team too. And at the end of the day, I know their teammates. Look, you've got to look out after each other. I get that, but at the end of the race, there comes a point everybody talks about,

I've got to look out for my own team. I guess my question, and maybe only Daniel Sforaz can answer this, is what's the expectation for Ross Chastain? What's he supposed to do in that situation? And are you going to put the reins if you're Justin Marks on Ross Chastain in a situation like that? I don't think so. I think you're thinking the guys in ninth, this

turn one is a crazy turn. Unleash the hams and let it go. And let's do what happens. Ross Chastain said, I didn't get mad when I got spun. I just tried to get my car to start. And you know, to Ross Chastain's credit, he actually rebounded and came all the way back to fourth from falling pretty deep in the field and also recovering from a pit

stop that had dropped him from the top five deep in the field. Where it appeared that he was going to be the lone challenger at one point to William Byron and Tyler Reddick running for the win. So yeah, I guess it's a lot to process, doesn't it? But I'm just wondering, I think that Ross Chastain said to Daniel Sures and would agree with your question to

Sures, like, what do you expect? I just wonder if like, at what point is that rationalization of, hey, I can race guys however I want to. I mean, maybe that's what the essence of Ross Chastain is. Yeah, maybe that's just his worldview, right? Like is that I'm sorry, but like, I'm going to race you the way you race me and you can expect me to race

you always with just hammer down and beat in the crap out of you. And that's why I guess he doesn't get upset when people run into him for the most part. Well, I was just like Alex Bowman said. He said he felt like the race he was in barricading in a sense. Everybody, a lot of people are doing it. The front of the field was as

respectful as could be. Now again, once you get three, four rows back, everybody's going for everything. These cars are indestructible. Reddick made the reference of the post race press conference about the clash. It was amazing watching the clash, just how guys would send it into the corners and know that there was no way they were going to make it without running in the back of somebody

and the guys just kept doing it. One guy did it, another guy did it, and it was pretty soon. That was the standard way of going into the corner. A NASCAR 1 to address it, they could have had done it at the clash, where it was an exhibition race, where it wouldn't have mattered. But again, that puts on a show cars beating and banging and some

action and things like that. NASCAR are going to step in for this over what happened and turn one at Dakota. No, because it's beaten and banging and action like that. And so what happens is if the officials aren't going to step in, then drivers have to elevate. They have to be more aggressive. I'm sorry if that's not how the gentlemanly racer drives a road course, but

that's the way it's done in NASCAR. When you get these vendors and you get these cars that I'm not going to say are indestructible, but are pretty hard to beat on. Let me ask you that. Let me say, remember when it was with the previous car that everybody was complaining about, there was no contact beating and banging at the door track, because if you made any

contact whatsoever, you knocked in a fender that cut a tire. There's no benefit to doing it. Well, now the fenders don't cave in. You're just going to smack people. And you're just going to hit the corners. So that's what it's become. I don't think it's going to change. I don't even know how NASCAR could change it, because I don't think you could have penalized people for

it because we do. You're going to penalize 20 cars at a time. I don't think NASCAR would want to change it, because to your point, the reason they were strengthened was because too many cut tires, not just short tracks, but speedways, like everywhere the one cut tires, number of doors, any damage. They definitely want to get away from that. You're right, like Tyler Redick said in

the post race today, these front and rear bumpers are now so resilient. You can hit somebody really hard without knocking anything off. And you're right, we saw that the clash, and we certainly saw it with Ross Chastain kind of bulldozing his way a little bit to a fourth place finish, and giving credit for that. Wasn't the best day, by the way, for trackhouse, and that not

only you have Daniel Swerich finish in 27, but you also had Kimi Reichen in, F1 champion, in his second start finishing 29th. Of course, he was one of many interlopers in this race. Conor Daly from Indy Car Series, finished his 36th, Jordan Taylor, and Chase Elliott's car, finishes 24th, but the best finish of the interlopers. Jensen Button, 2009, former the one champion, finishes 18th in the

Rikware Racing Ford. Button had an interesting comment afterward, Dustin, he said, trying to place my car in the right place, I just got it wrong every time. And normally if you're a little bit slow through a corner, nobody tries to overtake you on the outside, because they're not gonna make it all the way on the next one. But here they do, because they get a weird

inside for the next one, and if you turn, then you turn around. So the first thing was really bad. I thought it was embarrassing for me. And as I guys, we need to pay it, we need to get a fresh out of the tires on, and I need some fresh air. And I got that, and pace was good, consistency was good, I was really happy, and

passed a few cars, which was nice. And we got a little bit unlucky with the safety car, because it was just two laps before our window. And it didn't, the next step was made up. We also made a couple of changes, which didn't work. Big oversphere, it went from like, car feeling great to really difficult to drive. I also had a massive whack from Kenny, and

it fell after that, the car wasn't quite right. So every time I turned in, the rear tires would chatter, and immediately to overseas. So it was really difficult, but then towards the end, we made some good calls on stopping and quenching fresh tires on. And I enjoyed the last few restarts. Got a good place, and I would be glad to be taking the journey outside, and

to finish 18th after almost stopping, because I had heat exhaustion. So hot, I don't have a fan in my seat. Listening didn't really help me too much. I was so hot, I thought I was going to fake on the car, obviously. So I stopped twice for a minute. They put ice on me, getting loads of water, and I went back out, but so close to getting

out of the car, because I thought I was going to fake. So I must have drank eight bowls of water, and I'm not a water in the race. The team can become a reason to get the ZLVN, so I was happy. We talk a lot about our drivers' athletes. I think our NASCAR drivers' athletes, we saw from NF1 driver day on a hot day in Austin,

Texas. These guys are athletes, and I know you were listening to Buttons Radio as well, and you kind of heard that progression through the race, too. Yeah, I listened to them, especially at the end of the race, and it was really intriguing what he said, because he mentioned to his team, he says, these cup drivers are on it every second of the race, and he also

goes on to call the race a roller coaster, saying, quote, a whole F1 season in one race. And so it was a hard day for him. I think at the end of the way it came out, I think you'll look back on POM this fondly. Obviously, this is not the last time that we're going to see him. We'll see him at Chicago. He'll be there, and

we'll also do the ND Road course. So he's got two more races left with this Rikware ride with the partnership with Stuart-Hoss Racing. So as he gets a little bit more experience, maybe gets another better performance. He can top this 18th, can he get a top 15, can he get a top 10 if things work out. But after the race, his immediate reaction was kind of

a appreciation and enjoying the experience, I think is a good sign for him, and for the NASCAR fans. I think a lot of people, when I tweeted out, were really appreciative that he looked at it that way, and we're looking forward to seeing him come back and race again later this year. Yeah, it'll be great to see him at the Chicago Street course race very curious

to see how an F1 driver does in the first NASCAR Cup Series Street race ever. That'll be entertaining. Well, it certainly felt like probably a full NASCAR season for some of these drivers as well, Dustin, with the extended overtime. And we were talking before we got started here. This is pretty much the quarter pole of the regular season. When you look at where some of these

guys are positioned in the points, I think the me, the guy really jumps out, Dustin, is Carl Larson finishes 14th today and is now 27th in the point standings. And granted, a lot of that is because of the penalty that Hendrik Motorsports got for its hoodlubers at Phoenix that's going to be the appeal we heard soon this week. So that could change. But to me, what's

interesting here is where Carl Larson is relative to his other teammates. I mean, he's five spots behind William Byron. He's 11 spots behind Alex Bowman, where I feel like, again, depending on what happens with the appeal, I feel like if at this point you're outside the top 20, top 25 in points, it'll be pretty hard to make the playoffs on points, especially if there were as

many winners or close to it as there were last year. I almost feel like Carl Larson might be getting in a must win territory, not that he can't win. He can win in anything. And the Hendrik Motorsports has had the fastest cars this year. But it's interesting to me that that team is not off to the kind of start they would want to have either. Well,

I'll just think about this. If the appeal goes against Hendrik later this week, and they don't get those hundred points back, what point are you entering a must win situation for multiple drivers at Hendrik? I mean, I think everybody expects it to be a must win situation for Chase Elliott to make the playoffs because he's going to miss so many races. What if Larson has a

couple bad races here the next couple of weeks and falls further back? Then you have essentially the last two cup champions for Hendrik Motorsports in must win situations rest of the regular season. I'm not as worried about Larson at this point because of the speed. Again, it's interesting. You think about the two wins that William Byron has. Those were situations where Larson was strong and Byron

beat him on a restart. If they split that, then at least Kyle's got that win. I think another thing that's just as big in a sense is William Byron, although he's in a better situation with the wins. He doesn't have those playoff points at least as of right now because they lost those 10 playoff points in the penalty. I want to see what this appeal does

and see what happens here. I like the speed that Hendrik cars have. I'm going to see who else can close the gap if others can and how that happens the next few weeks. I think it'll be an interesting stretch here. We're getting to the short track season with Richmond next. You've got the Bristol dirt race which you're going to put Tyler Radick, Kyle Larson, Chris Ferville.

I'm sure most people are going to have those three on their fantasy teams going into that race just because of their dirt background and what they can do there. I think Larson's got some opportunities coming up. If he falters, it could get a little interesting, especially if they don't win that appeal this week. It does get interesting, but he does some opportunities. Like you said, Asgard

has had its first road course of the season with Coda next week for a short track of the season with Richmond race. They first track under a mile in length. What do you make of what we might see at Richmond as a strategy leading the fair this race a year ago? We saw Danny Hamlin kind of come out of nowhere the last hundred laps and win

the race. What do you look for for Richmond this weekend and who else might be looking at potential rebounds aside from Kyle Larson? Yeah, I think that's going to be the fascinating thing is how the cautions play out. And that's the one thing we've seen at Richmond in years past here lately is that there haven't been as many cautions. So there is that element of strategy

what we saw with Danny and Chris Gavehart making the pit calls to go get the tires and go run everybody down that they'd stayed out. So I'll tell you a couple guys that kind of stand out to me is even though we talk about the Toyota struggles on the road courses, I look at what Christopher Bell has done this season. He's spitting points and he's had

some strong runs this year, top 10s, top 5s. This is a guy that I think can do some big things here the next few weeks and it wouldn't surprise me and that he can really kind of assert himself. A couple of guys that are kind of intriguing to me is we've seen how RFK racing has been better this year. I mean today was not a good

day for Brad keselowski although his teammate Chris Boucher did get a top 10. What can the RFK cars do? Can they start to contend with some of these others? I think it'll be interesting. Again, the clash is not like every, these other short tracks but the RFK cars didn't advance to the feature this year just like last year but are they better on the short tracks?

What do we see out of them coming up? I guess obviously after today is how Daniel Suarez and Ross Chastain race around each other because I'm sure they're gonna be around each other over the next few weeks on these short tracks and I'll throw one other name. Hey, a guy who finished 11 today, Corey LaJoy. It was his saying is stacking pennies and he keeps doing

it. He's had one finish outside the top 20 this year in the first six races which if that's a Hendrick organization, that's not good but this is Spire Motorsports where they don't have as many people, they don't have the resources and they're making the most of what they have. Corey LaJoy's 15th and points and is in a playoff position after six races. Maybe if Hendrick gets

its points back, that changes but I'm not sure how many people would have predicted Corey LaJoy being 15th and points as we come toward the quarter pole mark of the regular season. So look, they've got their challenges. There's no doubt about that and with having a couple of the super speedway type races early on kind of falls into their favor. Maybe they pull some things out

here the next few weeks on some of these short tracks and then you've got Taladega coming up after that. So maybe this is still a good stretch for Corey LaJoy and the Spire Motorsports team could be a fun team to watch. Yeah, 15th and points. Definitely keep an eye on that team and you mentioned Brad Kuzlowski, I'm pressed up that he's 19th and points as well

through six races. So RFK certainly better than it was a year ago. You will be in Richmond, correct? Dustin, this weekend? Yes, I'm right on the road for the next month or so. All right, I know that's where you love it. So you can catch Dustin's NASCAR talk coverage from Richmond this weekend. I'll be Indy Car race, Texas Motor Speedway, Motorsports talk on NBCSports.com. Check out

all the coverage along with Mike Embry and Dan Beavers coverage as well. So Dustin, this was a lot of fun. Thanks for doing it. Hey, thanks a lot. I appreciate, good times. We appreciate Dustin Long for joining us on the NASCAR and NBC podcast. Thanks to Motorsports Manager Emily Conboy for recording this episode and helping with the recording. Thanks to Zach Tansiret for all the audio

that he compiled post-race at Circuit of the Americas in Austin, Texas today. Go to NBCSports.com or the Motorsports on NBC YouTube channel. And you can check out the video, the company, several of the sound bites that you heard on the podcast today from Zach. You can especially watch that great interview with Jensen Button. And as always, you can find more news, columns, and analysis on NASCAR

talk and Motorsports talk on NBCSports.com. Please visit NBCSports.com slash NASCAR or NBCSports.com slash Motors. Check out coverage for myself, Dustin Long, Mike Embry, and Dan Beavers. If you have any NASCAR and NBC podcast feedback, consent to me on Twitter at Nate Ryan is my neighbor. Thanks again for listening to the NASCAR and NBC podcast. Reed Farrell