Founder of Atlas Reality Beau Button

Hi, my name is San Tito. This is CryptoKid Podcast. I'm going to be talking to you guys about blockchain technology and cryptocurrency. Hello and welcome back to CryptoKid Podcast. Today I have a special guest, the CTO of Atlas Reality. And why don't you give us a little brief history about you and how you started the company. Yes, sir. So my name is BoButton. I've been in

it and started building our own games. And then about a year ago, we re rebreached and then we branded as Atlas Reality for multitude of reasons. No one could spell servers or pronounce servers. So we just felt like Atlas Reality was a better play. And of course the abbreviations were AR similar to augmented reality. But yeah, I mean we started the business with the idea of

building games for folks and we ultimately pivoted and now we're building games for ourselves and for our players. Awesome, awesome. I hear you have a lot of neat projects going on and especially with real estate and selling on the game ads. Yeah, I mean our core kind of focus has always been location based games. I'd be lying if I said we weren't inspired by Niantic and

their success with Pokemon Go. And even before Pokemon Go Niantic had seen a pretty high level of success with a game called ingress. For those who are not familiar with like this genre of location based games quite literally you have to walk around go outside and navigate in reality. But our first game was a strategy game, kind of an amalgamation between Pokemon Go and Clash of

Clans. It was a commercial success. We learned a lot. It was our first game with our own IP in house. And then our second game, which is the game that you mentioned, which is a virtual real estate game is called Atlas Earth. That's by far the most successful title that we built in house. And that's where most of our energy is being focused right now. Now

can you use it on desktop? Or can you is it both for on your D apps or just some of the things that you can do? No, right now we're off chain. So there's really nothing you can do on the web today. We do have a web application component in the works. For a multitude of reasons. One of which is we've run a muck of some

of Apple's terms of services. Specifically for our merchant program. As everybody's probably well aware, Apple, you know, even when it comes to Web 3 they just recently updated their terms as you know, a lot of people are going to be like, you know, what their stance is on governing NFT sales in a similar kind of vein. They basically denied our application for merchant rewards. So we're

bringing all of that to the web. So our iOS users can, you know, basically participate in that. You won't necessarily play the game on the web, but it'll be a companion application where you can manage the land and you can do several other things that make sense on a desktop versus, you know, a mobile phone. Awesome. Awesome. I can't wait for that to actually drop out.

I have a, I have my one of my mentors. He's he's a little bit older gentleman and he wants to get into to the metaverse and he's he's in the real estate and an actual reality. And he's like, man, I've been doing some study on Web 3 and I want to buy a shoe store in the metaverse. And I was like, you will just give us

some time. Yeah, I mean, I have no doubt that these decentralized plays these, you know, on chain Web 3 virtual real estate platforms, you know, they will stick. And internally at Atlas reality, even though Atlas Earth is off chain, we are very active and heavily investing in our Web 3 strategy, but you will find a need for cosmetics. And, you know, if his desire is to

own a shoe store, maybe he owns a brick and mortar, maybe he's a cobbler or something like that in real life, there's going to be a need and quite frankly, that needs been around for a very long time, even before we call this the metaverse. I remember playing, you know, second life. And I'm going to be a little bit older. If you need it something specialized,

there were people, there were, you know, artisans in the game, making things in 3D and adding the scripting, you know, to make them interactive. So this is a little different because if you buy it or if you own the store, you can actually make money and, you know, pay bills with it. Although you have to go through tokenomics and all that, you know, jazz. But yeah,

that's interesting. It does he have a shoe store in real life. I'm just curious why someone would want a shoe store. No, he has a bunch of real estate properties and rentals and everything. So you're just trying to come up with a new niche. No, look, sneakers are, I mean, I have friends I collect them. As you could see behind me, I collect video game consoles,

but those things can get expensive. So it makes it makes sense for him to want to, you know, get in, you know, on the action before kind of, you know, gets too hot. Mine would be a coffee shop. Yeah. So any place where people can socialize, you know, I haven't really connected with the app. What's going to motivate me personally to put on a headset or

even on my mobile phone, like I'm sitting here next to an Oculus Pro, Oculus Quest Pro. And I've been playing with it, you know, full immersion is magical, but like, I'm trying to figure out like where would I want to be in the metaverse? Like what I'm not going to be at a coffee shop. If I need caffeine, I'm going to go to Starbucks or some

coffee shop and actually get real caffeine. But, you know, as a developer or a technologist, I find myself compelled to like go to meeting rooms and have a whiteboard with people. Maybe I would never, you know, meet in person and kind of just pontificate about software, architecture and things like that. So it's definitely an interesting concept, but not everybody. It's not at one size fit all

like what I want out of the metaverse is probably very different than what you want out of the metaverse. And that's that's something that we'll need to, you know, accommodate. Now are you applying NFTs to your to Alice Earth? There's no plans right now to bring Atlas Earth on chain. There's a multitude of reasons. One of which is the barrier to entry right now for any

gap is real high. And our kind of special sauces, user acquisition and low friction first time user experiences, which aren't in the matrix when you describe web 3 at all. So we are building a new game. It's kind of in the ideation phase right now. We just received our provisional patent for our use of NFTs in the game. It's a very unique way using NFTs. But

long story short, no, not for Earth, but for the next game. That we build it will indeed leverage NFTs. Amazing. Now, would that be one of the ways you define web 3 and the metaverse? Me personally, no. I don't think web 3 or the metaverse. It's often spoken about in the same context as like it's blockchain, it's smart contracts, you know, this decentralized distributed ledger. I

like to take a step back from all of that. That's just. New technology. It's the evolution of the internet. There is a huge push in certain communities for decentralization for various reasons. But me personally, what I think and how I describe web 3 is players or social media users or just consumers will have equity in what it is that they're doing. So like right now, they

are the currency. If you're not paying for product, you are the product. And I think the evolution of the internet is consumers will have some type of skin in the game. And if that is, you know, NFTs in your wallet that you can then bring to open sea and liquidate to earn cash, then great. But it doesn't demand that. There are so many other rails out

there that could facilitate that have been around for much longer than blockchain. Our goal is to use what we're familiar with and what end users are familiar with. But I do think the evolution in the future is we will be on chain because it just makes sense. Why have a bunch of different independent silos or walled garden systems? I don't communicate with one another. Why not

leverage and L1 or L2 chain a lot of portability of assets. So I'm in the middle and all of that, but it doesn't require it at all. Okay. Now, where do you see play to earn now? And where do you think it's going to be in the future? That's a tough one. Quite honestly, there have been a few, I mean, very large successful companies in the

play to earn space. The one that I think most people associate with play to earn is Axi and Finity. I was never a fan of their model. I felt like it was, they were taking advantage of the Filipino people. It was just the way it all kind of was structured was was predatory in my personal opinion. But, you know, there's been some success in the play

to earn. I think quite frankly, even though we're off chain, we're still in that genre. We have players earning 20, 30, 40 dollars a month. I think that's a lot of work. And I know that doesn't sound like a lot of money. And it's really not in the grand scheme of things. But I think right now, we're still trying to figure out, you know, what does

it look like from a business model perspective? It's relatively complicated and it's new. I think in the future, we'll see more games leverage these types of play to earn mechanics and share some equity with the players, whether that be NFTs that they can sell in the secondary market, where it's tokens or in our case, Fiat. We just, we pay them cash. I think it's here to

stay. I don't think this is something that's a fad. Yeah, right now, like just talking to all my close friends, they're saying that cash is king. And they just don't listen to me about cryptocurrency or blockchain technology when it comes to earning money because their biggest argument is that it's not backed by anything. And also, I was talking to my coworker the other day. And he

was just like, I don't trust it because we just went through a hurricane and all the electricity went out and he's like, no one was able to go to the ATM and get cash. They had already have cash on hand. So I think people who feel much comfortable with just having actual money. I mean, there's certainly certainly a percentage of the population. I don't know what

it is, but, you know, my mom is relatively old school. And she kind of operates on that same, you know, under that same mindset, which is it's, I like cash. And now we're seeing a lot of merchants going cashless, where they don't even take cash. I'm not afraid of a digital first economy. I used my debit card with contactless. I used my phone with, you know,

NFC contactless. So if that's being powered by the visa or master card rails or a blockchain, I don't care nor does the merchant. You know, your friends, you know, I don't care. Friends that have concerns about, you know, the, I guess the volatility of the crypto market, look, all of the markets are manipulated. And they're not being manipulated by folks like us. They're being manipulated to

some degree by large corporations, large, you know, token holders, etc. It doesn't matter what we do. If there's money to be made, there's someone that's going to try to fight to have power and control, even if it's decentralized. So, yeah, I mean, I understand where they're coming from and I respect that. But I'm not afraid. I'm not afraid of the money to use Bitcoin if emergent,

you know, accepts Bitcoin. And I feel like using Bitcoin. But more often than not, I'm pulling out a credit card and I'm just using NFC. But, you know, it's, it's, it is confusing. It is very confusing. You know, like why does BTC go up and down? Why does ETH go up and down? You know, can people answer that same question about the dollar or stock markets?

Like there's a lot going into this. It's not a simple problem. But as a consumer, you know, the trust right now, I'm not afraid of the money. My personal opinion is with traditional rails, which are your banking systems and your credit and debit cards that people are familiar with and they trust. Dude, I was trying to buy a vehicle about six months ago. And I was

trying to use, I was trying to wire them money, like Fiat Cash. And they just, they didn't want to do it. And I was just trying to figure out why. And so I talked to my roommate and he was just like, they're probably worried about you canceling the payment. I was like, I'm not going to cancel a payment. To get a vehicle. So yeah. I mean,

look, deal dealers are really sketchy when it comes to buying cars outright, which is kind of countering to it. If everybody thinks like, well, you know, if you can get alone and that loans interest rate is, you know, 4%, but you feel like you can take your money and earn 10% then you'd be better off getting a loan, paying the 4%. But most dealers make more

money, not on the initial sale, but on the basis points for financing. So I've had a, I'm not going to say that I'm going to be a little bit more serious. But actually one of my, my old business partners tried to do the same thing, but with cash. Like he walked in there almost, it felt like he was a drug dealer of some sort. And it

wasn't like he was behind a Ferrari. It was and cool. No, not on the court. I think it was a relatively reasonable car. And they're like, Oh, no, we can't take cash. We can't do this. We need a certified. I mean, I was kind of, you know, taking a back. But yeah, they, they are afraid of you cancelling. I mean, in our world, we see players

on a daily basis, make $100 purchase. In, you know, the Apple App Store and then basically contact Apple. And I've seen every excuse under the rainbow. My, my, I was, you know, taking prescription medications. And I didn't mean to do it. My three year old daughter. And it certainly did it. But, you know, I get where they're coming from. But I'm not sure that blockchain. I

mean, it's, it's not reversible in that sense. But just think about the, the person that you spoke to at the dealership. Do you think they understand like crypto and web three and like all of the nuances. I doubt it. They probably don't understand. The an AC agent credit or debit, but, um, yeah, it's tough. It's tough. Thank you. Thank you for clearing that for me. And

I know we got off the, off the metaverse. So let's get back into it. Where do you, where do you, where do you see consumers spending the most time in the metaverse now and down the line? I mean, to be blunt, they aren't in the metaverse for right now. Very few people are in the metaverse for right now. If you, you know, you want to use

like the industry's definition of the metaverse. Um, again, my definition is for, for, for web three and the metaverse, it's just the, you know, basically innovation that we're seeing on the tech side, but it's the evolution of the internet. So, you know, when I started, it was desktop with dial up and then gradually, you know, when the first iPhone came out, I mean, we had phones

prior to the iPhone, but, you know, it was flip phones with very limited connectivity options. You play games and emails, et cetera. And then we had mobile phones and we had tablets. And now we have AR and VR. Um, I do not consider the metaverse a AR or VR or XR exclusive experience, meaning I don't think the metaverse will ever require a headset. You may be

able to leverage some interesting functionality with, you know, let's say apples, AR glasses or an Oculus Quest or, you know, whoever comes out with a new headset. So I'm pretty certain that players or consumers are going to interact with the metaverse through their mobile phone. And if you think about the experiences that we're seeing today, like sandbox and decentralized, their mobile experience is, is bad. Um,

there are a web based platform, their desktop. So, um, I don't, I, I don't image me personally, I'm not going to log in and go into some three dimensional world, just to chat with my friends. I'm sure there's a large audience for that. Like I've used VR chat, rack room. I played them all. It's cool. So I mean, where they are now is nowhere to be

seen. No one's really playing. If you look at the number of people that are on the internet versus how many people are in these metaverse experiences, it's there's no comparison. But I do believe that's going to, you know, change over the next probably 10 years. Like that's the time horizon that my brain's kind of like wrapped it's head around, which is. Alright, so. The technology that

we have access today, if you want to build a fully immersive interactive three years, you have to be an developer, you know, and that's not cool because there are a lot of creative people that aren't developers, but they know how to do, you know, 3D modeling or animation or audio, whatnot. So I think over the next two, three years, we're going to start seeing more platforms

to allow user generated metaverses and brands will jump on that. So brands might have, you know, instead of having somebody who's doing their videos for Facebook, Facebook and TikTok, you know, just using Adobe Premiere, they'll have somebody using these tools to build these metaverses. I don't believe there's a lot of other developers experiences, but I do believe there's going to be in 3D to some degree.

I appreciate that, but I don't believe people are going to be walking around with Oculus or AR headsets everywhere. They're too expensive and quite honestly, you can't stay in it for very long before you get sick. So that was kind of an indirect answer to your question. I mean, like I said, today, they're really not in the metaverse. In the future, I think it's going to

be a combination of the devices that we use today, you know, desktop mobile and AR VR XR. I think it's about VR's and he was showing me some websites and things that you could use VR for. And I was like, and then I hear when the metaverse came out, I was like, isn't that like the metaverse, I was my speculation of it. And I thought they

kind of like co, they went together in a sense. It does. So VR augments, no pun intended or enhances the experience that people are calling a metaverse experience, which is. It's a game. I mean, it's not the metaverse is not a game, but we're leveraging game engines. We're building these 3D fully interactive fully immersive technologies. If you've never used an Oculus Quest or any HTC vibe

to play a VR game, it will change the way you think about all of this. It is just as empowering or impactful as it was the first time I saw my iPhone that I bought the first generation iPhone before they even had a developer, you know, extensibility model, like where you could build your own apps for iPhone. I bought the iPhone and having gone from a

flip film, I was just looking at this thing and holy crap. This is the future. The minute you put on one of these headsets, even if you're not a developer, you know, if you're a developer, your brand is going to instantly start saying, how on the hell do I do this? How does this work? And I think that's a good thing. As a consumer, you start

thinking, well, hell, this is how I'm going to interact with things in the future. And there's applications today where you can, you know, have a shared whiteboard session with a co-work or anybody. You can sit across from somebody in a table and a game, which, you know, again, game metaverse three dimensional experience that line's going to blur. And truly, this is going to become the internet.

Now, I don't believe the internet is going to be exclusively 3D in the future, but I think a lot of what we will be doing will probably be in 3D. Okay. Yeah. And it took me down the rabbit hole too. So there's been some case studies that people actually just spending all their time on it. And it causes problems with the cognitive too. And I'm just

looking. I don't think it's any different than, you know, as a parent, the phrase that schools use is screen time. You know, some schools will try to help you limit your child's screen time. You know, I think it is a healthy thing. I grew up in front of a screen and I'm 39. So this idea of screen time and limited use. And it's not new, but

like, I'm not joking. There's probably, I can count. Since I was eight years old, I don't think there's been a single day. Maybe, maybe one or two here and there. Where I haven't looked at some screen. You know, if I'm not sitting in front of a screen, writing software, I'm either in front of my phone. So I do believe we need to learn and study the

impact on the internet. And the brain were too quick as a society to just jump to like, oh, shit, this is the next thing since, like, the best things in sliced bread. But me personally, it's not so much. I think it impacts my cognitive abilities. I'm not in it long enough to even like to witness that. But it is nauseating at times. And I'm not one

who gets motion sickness. Now this new Oculus Quest pro is better. I think it handles it better. But yeah, I don't want to, you know, promote technology that's going to basically suck the life out of our young, you know, children. But I think there's going to need to be a balance that strike, you know, just like screens today and iPads. I remember growing up. My mom

always used to yell at me saying, you're sending too close to the TV backup. So it's funny now. But it's the same thing that my mom would say is you spend too much time on the internet. She's in her seventies. And now she's spending 10 hours on the internet doing all kinds of stuff. And when when I come to her house, she's three inches away from

the screen because she can't see. So it's funny. Everything they told us not to do. And they're older age. They have to do. But no, it is, it is kind of a roundabout thing. Okay. Now with all this new technology coming out, how do you feel about regulations? And are you worried about the government taking control? All right. So I know this is a hot topic

like privacy and big brother and the government. I'm not personally afraid of the government. I know there's bad actors. There's bad actors. I'm not going to, you know, polarize left, right, first, et cetera. But regulations, specifically for consumer protection. As a consumer, as someone who's had to, you know, file complaints, you know, you've got the better business bureau. And you've got all of these other things

like the FDIC insurance that you get by having, you know, a bank account with Chase JP Morgan or something like that. Consumers need that. And you know, I mean, I don't know. And right now, the Web Three Spaces, A, unregulated, and there's no protection. We're seeing this left and right. I'm full regulation. Now I'm not one where I want them to manage everything. And I have

no freedom. We do have to strike a balance. But I'm absolutely full regulation for consumer protection. I'm not overly concerned about the government seeing the money that I move. I earn it. I work my ass off to earn it. I put it in a check and account. And at the end, I'm not going to be able to do that. And then I have nothing to hide

from them. I know a lot of people don't feel that same way. But that's just my perspective on it. Mine too. Mine too. Now what's your target audience for your company? Well, for Alice Earth, you know, our demographic right now, we just kind of happened. We run ads on different social media platforms. And, you know, initially you don't control who responds. We do know now who's

responding to those ads. And the majority of our end users are going to be young, you know, males. So I mean, that's our demographic. Me personally, you know, as a partner in the company, I'm not targeting young children or teenagers. I think this platform is aligned with individuals that are 18 and above that have a check and account that have some free time that are interested

in passive income. It is a video game. So it's not like it's an investment platform. But, you know, I do want to take what we have today. This platform and our user base, you know, it's over a million users. And somehow we've in financial literacy, you know, educating people about how to save and where to go on the internet to sign up and, you know, set

up a brokerage account. So you can take the money that you may have and grow it, you know, securely. Rather than invest in a dogecoin and, you know, you can't just rely on must-tweet one thing and you lose your life savings. But, you know, right now it's pretty much anybody who has a check and account that has some spare time that is interested in virtual real

estate. I think we'll narrow that down just a tad bit. But there's nothing in the game that would prohibit someone, you know, a female versus a male or anybody who's older versus younger from playing it. But we're very clearly attracting younger males that are looking for passive income that have some free time on their hands. And I think that's because in high school, especially in the

public school system, they really don't teach you things that you need to know when you graduate and things to prepare you for adulthood, which I think they should. Because no, look, I went through public school as well. And I was pretty much a self-taught person. It sounds silly saying that haven't gone through 12 years of school. Now, I didn't teach myself like in pre-K and kindergarten,

but I'd say around that sixth grade level, the teachers effectiveness and the Louisiana public school systems just went to hell in a hand basket. And I was very fortunate that I was intellectually prepared to just take the book home, read what I needed to read and understand it and, you know, ask questions, et cetera. Not everybody can learn like that, but they didn't teach me anything

about, you know, financial literacy. We had an economics class. We talked about all kinds of macro things, but they didn't talk about, well, what does your first peg check look like? What the hell is FICA? What are these components? I know so many young kids get their first paycheck and they're just depressed at how much money goes to the government. And that's step one, but step

two is, is, well, if you take 10%, 20% of your paycheck and put it in a high interest yield, checking account or something like that in 10 years, it could be 100,000. If they would have just had those very candid conversations, I think a lot more people would be financially sound right now, but they're not. And then look, there's a lot of other outside factors. I'm

not saying it to just the education component, you know, you do need a work hard, you need to save, you need a budget and things like that. But that's where it should have started. Instead of like even in college, like obviously that's not the focus of college. It's, you learn this shit literally in real life. You just learn it the hard way. And that's not a

good situation for most people. Exactly. And exactly when I first got my check with my construction job, I was just like, what are tax taxes? And like a son of a large, I feel like a large portion of me was taking out. And I was just like, this is not even right. I was like, I worked hard for this. And I'm giving a talk on sand.

So I was just like, well, look, that sentiment is what I think powers or drives most of the, the distrust in our government today. It's like, where does that money go? You know, as a citizen, we speak with our votes. Like today, you know, everybody, go out and vote. Please, regardless of your party, go out and vote and do your, you know, civic duty. But I've

always kind of like fantasized about this web based system, where yes, we pay into the taxes, the tax system. But as consumers, we can say, you know, I think our defense budget should be less and we should increase our education budget. Now you can do that indirectly through voting. But I'm not entirely sure that it works the way that I wanted to work. But yeah, I

remember my first paycheck as well. And I was shocked. I was just like, man, I was back in the day when I don't know what minimum wage was $5 or something an hour. So, you know, $40 was a tremendous amount of money. And when you're looking at your taxes, every paycheck, you're like, holy hell, man, this is, this is, and when you're young, you don't really

think that like, well, what do I need from the government? Well, the road, the lights, the public services, all that is unique from the government. But it takes you a long time as, you know, as you grow and as you matured, it's a very fully appreciated. What it is that those tax dollars do for you, but I'm still not convinced that even 50% of it's going

to where it needs to go. A lot of its waste, it misappropriated, et cetera. And that could be depressing when you just think about it. But it's a big issue that not one person can solve. Now you talked about like this educational and finances, is there going to be like a verification factor? Like that way, people don't have multiple, multiple user names per se or making

sure you're actually giving them money to the person that's supposed to have it? Yeah, right now, our terms of service, we just recently updated them to kind of reflect, learn, you know, our, the lessons we learned and delivering this game and, you know, the community and working with our lawyers. We don't have an obligation to the IRS or anybody to report if you withdraw $5 or

$20. And we do need to strike a balance between, you know, what we think needs to be governed or regulated versus like what's going to introduce too much friction. So right now, we do not have a KYC process because a, there's no crypto play, not that KYC's unique to crypto. It's obviously more prevalent in crypto platforms because crypto unfortunately gets a bad rap and is often

used for laundering and things of that nature. But we don't have any plans to date to make KYC mandatory. We do have plans as people approach the $600 IRS 1099, like contractor, you know, threshold, we will provoke them to enter in their EIN or rather their SSN and address so we can send them a 1099. But yeah, there's, it's something that we're still trying to evolve

and we're still trying to figure out where it makes sense. We just don't want to increase the friction. So there is a balance that needs to be, you know, kind of strike. Now, does that mean that we're going to have a balance between the two? So that has to do with leveraging the locality of the aspect. When you say locality, like we're only in the United

States right now. Okay. And from our understanding, having worked with a bunch of attorneys, both on the tax side, the Web 3 side, and, you know, just, you know, securities. The US is the most strict and has the most well defined process. So we're moving forward into other countries under the assumption that, and we're doing our due diligence, like for instance, one of the countries we're

entertaining is Australia. And as a company paying, you know, contractors or gamers in Australia, the onus is actually on the taxpayer. So the person receiving the funds. So it's easier for us to operate in Australia, because we don't have to file any paperwork with their local, you know, revenue system. I'm going to know what the hell it's called in Australia. It's not the IRS, but the

equivalent in Australia. So it will be dependent on locality. A lot of the game will be balanced differently as we move out into other countries, et cetera, based on the ad revenue that we receive. For instance, ads in India don't pay as well as ads in the United States. So if the game is, you know, basically leveraging the ad revenue to fund some of the virtual

rent. If we're not getting as much for ad revenue, we need that to be, you know, accommodated in our model for virtual rent in those countries. So yeah, it's going to be relatively dynamic. We're not growing. And we want to go to other countries, but because of these kind of like, obstacles, we have to do it very methodically. Okay. Now, since you're talking about obstacles, is

that the biggest problem that your team is facing? And how are you trying to resolve that? Like, what are you trying to do? Yeah, no, no, it's honestly, you know, this is a good problem. But I always joke as the CTO, this is the reason I don't have any hair. I literally sweat pure cortisol, the stress hormone. Now I'm built for this. My, my body, my

body, my body, my body, my body, my body, my body, my body. I may not think I'm built for it, but my brain's built for this. But our biggest problem today is scale. You know, when you're engineering a product, you have to, you know, there's a triangle, like speed quality, you know, and, and cost. So we built this product, this platform over the course of five

months, which is incredible compared to what it took to build our first game, which was two years. So I can't say we cut corners, but we talk about time to market was the metric we were focusing on. Let's get this thing shipped out the door. Let's get it in the hands of customers. And, and doing that, we, we didn't focus, you know, a lot of time

on stress testing the system and making sure that it would like stay online under load. So we've had some pretty big blunders as it relates to stability. Thankfully, our community is very forgiven and they understand that even if boxes and off lawns, they're still occurring virtual rent. But the biggest problem right now that we're facing is most definitely a technical challenge. We've got the right personnel

and we know what we need to do, but, you know, we have to do it while the systems online. And then that's presented a unique challenge. It's not new. Every tech company has gone through some type of growth technical challenge. But right now that is as a company as the CTO that's on the forefront of my mind is scaling the human side of the business, getting

the right talent in the door to help us move past this. And then we'll start our adding features. But all of these leaves, the obstacles quite frankly, we're working or we're partnering with big law firms that have way more experience than anyone, you know, internal counsel could ever have. So I'm very comfortable with that side. But, you know, finding the right engineers, growing the team, maintaining

the culture and actually getting things done. That's, that's the biggest problem we have. And, you know, I hate the word problem. That's where we're focusing most of our energy. But I'm absolutely confident that we'll get through it with every problem. There's a solution. Most definitely man, most definitely there is a solution. And I don't know many young folks that are, you know, perseverance, like I don't

give up. And this is a personality trait that everybody who knows me, well, I have no doubt if you ask them, they would agree is like, you just don't give up. You just have to look at it. You don't get depressed. You just keep working. You will eventually come up with a solution. You may need to pull in more people. You may need to raise more

money. You may need to do that. But right now we're financially sound. So, you know, outside of the technical obstacles, like secondary to that is hiring, you know, qualified engineers that fit in with, you know, our culture. And that's just time and practice. I've hired, you know, probably no less over the course of the last 15 years, 200 people. And you, you kind of, it's like

a musical instrument. You, you get in tune with people and you can tell almost off the bat if they're going to be a good fit or not. Now, that doesn't mean they're going to know how to write software. That's the hard part. But I'm less inclined to give them these challenging interview questions. And I am to just get them on the team and see what they

can do. But yeah, that's where we are, you know, obstacle wise. So we're getting close to any time. Is there anything you would like to share, like any news that's about to happen before we end the show? No, I mean, there's, there's not a whole lot of new news. I mean, anybody who plays Atlas Earth, they know that, you know, our schedule has been pushed back.

But it's all for basically you guys, the players. If anybody's interest, you can interested in learning about Atlas reality or Atlas Earth, you can just go to Atlas earth.com. But yeah, nothing major before the end of this year. I think we're, we're really going to make a huge flash is Q1 2023. We've got the right team. We know we need to focus on it. We've got

some pretty exciting things that will be announced and enrolling out behind schedule, but quite honestly, I've been doing software my entire life. Software estimations are BS. It's hard. But yeah, that's basically it. Nothing major this year. But Q1 2020. 2023 will have some pretty impressive things to roll out for our players. And, you know, hopefully we'll get more and people who listen to your, you know,

podcast will jump on. And if you have questions, you can find me on LinkedIn. All right. And all those will be in the description down below. Hey, man, I wish you the best with your numbers. And hopefully I'll see you in the future. Yes, sir, it was a pleasure. Do you take care of brother? You two, man. See you. Bye. Next question. Can Sam. And if

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