The Bitcoin Group #338 - The 2022 Bitcoin Group Ye

The Bitcoin Group, the American original for over the last 10 seconds, the sharpest Satoshi's, the best bitcoins, the hardest cryptocurrency talk. We'd like to welcome our panelists, Dan Eve, the crypto raptor. Happy 2022, guys. Michael Dupree from EasyBit. Hey, and I'm Thomas Hunt from the World Crypto Network. Moving on to this years, Bitcoin year in review, spectacular. I even have pom-poms for the person in the

audience. Are you guys ready to get started on the Bitcoin year in review, six-tactor Dan Eve? What was the best Bitcoin company from 2022? Well, you see, I'm going to have to go local for this one because there have been a lot of good companies and good companies doing some good work in Bitcoin. But I think it's down, I think Ellen Bits for me, Ellen Bits.

They've got funding. They're smashing it right now with all their extensions. They're becoming the WordPress of Bitcoin Lightning. And I think it's, yeah, Ben's done a tremendous amount of work for Ellen Bits. He's building a great company. He's a great team. And I'm all for Ellen Bits as being the best Bitcoin company 2022. The show. Michael Dupree, best Bitcoin company 2022. Okay. Look at that. Hello.

I think you're still with us. Mike, what's your point for the Bitcoin company 2022? I'll go with Kraken. the envelope. Are you ready? I do have the envelope. Hey, he's been hermetically sealed on Funken Wagnoles porch for over two weeks. This envelope once used by Johnny Carson and the car and Acabit. I have to put it to your head. You have to say what's inside what's

going to be inside, right? And then when you open it, you open it from the long end. You got to open it wide. There you go. Get all the out of there. Right. Here we go. Best Bitcoin company 2022. I think Dan has been looking inside the envelope because it is Ellen Bits. Ellen Bits. Best Bitcoin company 2022. They make easy paid off of Jack from

old Twitter. And they make stuff as Ben travels the world teaching workshops and helping people make real world useful Bitcoin lightning devices. And now, Noster decentralized Twitter replacement. The future is up, up, up with Ellen Bits. Best Bitcoin company 2022. Mike, Dupree, we're going to start with you this time. What's the worst Bitcoin company 2022? I guess we got to mention FTX. They deserve an honorable

mention here. Dan, Eever, you in agreement FTX, where's the Bitcoin company 2022? I think this is a there's a joint situation going on here. Right. I think his because FTX was the kind of the last of the big ones to fall. And arguably it probably maybe wouldn't have even fallen if it wasn't for three-hour capital Celsius block five because and verge digital because it's not going

to be a big one. And it's basically FTX like bailed them out like all of those guys. And Alameda, like you can't forget Alameda is being a shit company. And and and obviously this the categories worse Bitcoin company, but you know this is kind of taking more loosely is companies that have operated using, you know, taking people's Bitcoin or using Bitcoin, you know. But yeah, I

think it's a debt FTX definitely the worst of the worst, but there's some honorable mentions, I think for yeah, Celsius block five Voyager Alameda. Three-hour capital. Unfortunately. So many worst companies this year makes the category really easy. I agree with Mike FTX, allegedly using customer funds as a personal piggy bank, not holding any Bitcoin, losing all their customers, customers, money's on bad bets and dragging down

Bitcoin and crypto FTX is the worst Bitcoin company of 2022. Dan, either you're ready with our most defining moment of 2022. Here we go. Most defining way to hang was like, oh, this is the next one is it, right? Okay. The next category did I didn't hand you my envelope? Did now we only do it on the first one. The first one, right? Okay, because I've

got 17 envelopes here. You're all right. You're at least you got from Eric. Somebody did some operation work this time. Okay. So most defining moment. Um, um, they were two for me. So I think, um, some first of all, mad Bitcoin's being back on European tour, because I didn't think it was going to ever happen after the after the COVID stuff went down and everything was

looking all sketchy. And while travel still wasn't there. So, uh, so I think Kudos for getting back on it and having a great time over over here in Europe. And the second one I think for me was, um, was Craig Wright losing his lawsuit to against Hodlano, um, or shall I say, Hodlano winning his lawsuit against Craig Wright? Um, because it's just another moment that shows

that Bitcoin doesn't have a, it doesn't have a leader. It has, it's just, it's decentralized. It's distributed. It doesn't need a leader. And it doesn't need Craig Wright, who definitely is not so she. And it's proven time and time again. So I think that's, uh, yeah, I think that's probably the defining moment for me is, is Craig Wright losing that lawsuit, actually. Like to pre most

defining moment. I don't know if it's the most defining, but I would say a memorable moment was recently when Ray of Paxful started, uh, no longer offering a theorem. There was a big surprise even said in his announcement that he would take less profit that the company would make less money for that decision. Yeah. Someone, someone asked him if he'd, uh, he'd be like, oh, but

what about Litecoin? Will you accept Litecoin? He was like, no, no, no, no, no, no. Bitcoin's fine. Ray declaring that FTX was an old fashioned in bezeling case. The fraud had nothing to do with crypto. It was triumphant. And it was true. And it set the stage for the rest of the hearing. It was not crypto's fault. It was good old fashioned fraud. Once again, much

like the Titanic Oscars, this is the year of SBF and FTX. If they're not the center of every category, they're involved somehow most defining moment 2022. All right, Dan, Eve, biggest surprise. What was the biggest surprise in 2022? Um, for me, I think the, uh, often when you, when you hear about hacks, the, the money just really never find, you know, find its way back into

the, into the line. Obviously apart from some of the, the drags that were left over from, from Mt. Gox. So to hear that, um, not only did the, the, the 2016 bit, bit, finnex, Bitcoin hack, uh, the Bitcoin was, was found, but also in the fountains of some random, like lady rapper called Rasmcon, the crocodile of Wall Street. That was quite a random surprise. And, um,

yeah, we, we're still yet to find out what's going to happen with that Bitcoin that's confiscated. Is it going to go back to Bitfix? Is it going to go to the users? Is it going to go in the pockets of the, the US Treasury or something? Uh, I don't know. Nobody knows. So, um, yeah, that, that came out of the blue big, big one of billions

of Bitcoin. Maybe the biggest surprise would be if the users actually got their funds back. Like to pre biggest surprise 2022. Uh, I think the stuff going on and else out the doors, probably, uh, one of the biggest surprises to me that it's still trying to long over there. Has been impressive that, uh, to Bukheli didn't leave them with the price down that he didn't just

give up and run away. They're still standing. Bitcoin ground there. Yeah. It's way down to since they got started. Pretty much the worst possible scenario for them. I think we had them as, uh, one of the good categories last year with a better categories. But let's see here. Biggest surprise 2022. Trump NFTs. The anti technology president who doesn't use email or text messages to avoid self

incrimination steps forward with more than 4,000 45,000 profile picture NFTs offering. Out of nowhere, fleecing speculators of his fans of more than $4.5 million in just a few days. Currently, the price is even up in the future. It might not be. But for now, the former president has an extra $4.5 million in his pocket. As none of the money was designated to go for his alleged

campaign for president. Widely attacked by his own allies and enemies alike seen as a used car salesman. A new low for the office of former president. But what's the what an amazing surprise for 2022? Okay, Mike, do pre best new offering 2022. I have to go with some of the stuff that lightning network has been creating. Eightening network has been excellent. Dan Eve. What's your best

new offering 2022? Well, best may not be the word, but I think the funniest new offering is, is the winner of the previous category, which is that the Trump NFTs. No, for someone that turned around and said they, they hate it. Well, the Bitcoin was a scam to now having not just not just NFTs on Ethereum, but even more kind of detailed than that. They're on

polygon. Not that he probably knows anything about the networks or what they are. But I just thought it's just it's just hilarious. I mean, you look through some of the pictures and and you know, they're just really like if you were to design, if someone was to if someone was to hear a like, oh Trump's making NFTs. Like the NFTs. And I think that he's made

would be what someone would have characterized to mock him. If you know what I mean, like he's made things that people would have made to as it that were a joke about him. And that's what I think so funny about it. So maybe not the best new offering, but at least the funniest new offering. On it's been made all the better that he's allegedly used copyrighted

images in his NFTs and just trimmed out the watermark and that people now found pieces of the watermark on like the cowboy and the astronaut, whatever else that he put his little head on. It was an amazing offering, but I don't know about best new offering 2022, noster, the Twitter replacement, Ben's framework for using public and private keys to send status messages fleshed out by Fiat

Jeff and others with a power and help of the Ellen Bitts company. Also best Bitcoin company now has major funding backing and publicity from old Twitter's own Jack Dorsey 14 bitcoins and everyone in my Twitter feed talking about how to install noster. Decentralized apps may finally be here thanks to Ben, Ark, Fiat Jeff and others. Congratulations to Noster decentralized Twitter best new offering 2022. Mike Dupree,

what's the best technical innovation for 2022? This one's difficult for me. I, I, nothing really comes immediately to mind, but I'll go back again to the lightning network stuff that they've been building out, which is just I think really cool in general. A lot of people, especially in the media, don't even seem to know about the lightning network or mention it when they bring it up.

The fact that you can send small amounts of Bitcoin around using an alternate network. I think we need to keep advertising it until they do. Dan, Eve, what's your best technical innovation for 2022? So I like, I think we're tap green tap green, right? That was that came into 2022, but as it was, you know, it was enshrined in the blockchain. I mean, there's not been

a huge number of uses for it yet. And when you can see it, you know, like on different wallets, they now support taproot addresses. But there's not the kind of defy explosion that that some may have kind of thought was coming. The defy is going to move on to Bitcoin with taproot. But I think another technical innovation that I did like is the fact that on

the lightning side is that it's becoming a lot easier to switch from from lightning. To Bitcoin on chain, a lot more services doing it. And when I was working on this stuff like reward pool, people had, you know, it was difficult for them to get their lightning sets onto Bitcoin main chain, because not everywhere accepted Litecoin. And so services like even LM bits now has the

ability to to cash out. I'm not saying a cash out cash out is a bad word actually. But to switch between Bitcoin on chain and lightning. So I think it's making Litecoin. even slope than lightning, much more accessible to the users that are familiar with Bitcoin, but kind of, you know, haven't been so far, keen on touching Lightning. And also for those who are lightening who

are like how do I get my Sats now I've got enough Sats to to be on the main chaam. So more services, integrating Bitcoin to lightning in lighting to Bitcoin. you can do the past and say proof of reserves old technology, but suddenly full of great interest due to the FTX collapse, though it is so hard to prove often providing merely a snapshot of reserves rather

than an active security camera. Perhaps they and others should take a look at the ideas behind Josh Cigala and Vol Toro's glass books, Pro Deval and provide true transparency. Still, any step in the right direction is a good one. Proof of reserves is the best technical innovation 2022. All right, Dan. Actually, given, oh, just for sure, very quickly, given credit to, you know, because Kraken have

been mentioned as well, but in it was in reviewing articles from this year and it was August. So prior to the FTX sort of meltdown, but probably more of a product of or consequence of the Celsius block fine, all that kind down, but Kraken did do their proof of reserves and and and became a lot more publicly transparent. So I think kudos to Kraken for for

being ahead of the curve on that. More shout outs to Kraken. And now Dan, the other side of the coin, what's the most important thing that I've ever seen? The worst technical innovation 2022? Well, I found this so I found this difficult because because it so anything that to me, unless it's like introducing a bug on Bitcoin, anything's kind of an innovation is kind of good,

you know, it's an experiment. So I've gone for a slight kind of sidestep of that. So I've gone for no number one. So best of the worst technical. I don't know, the worst technical. Blunder was was Craig Wright again in the in the in the hot law case saying that he stopped on the hard drive that held Satoshi's keys as if like, you know, just jumping

on a hard drive would would completely break the disc and make it eligible and, you know, blah blah blah. And must have really heavy feet like insanely heavy feet. So that was that was a technical blender and also. The worst stifling of technical innovation. Sorry, I've invented my own category because I couldn't think of. The actual was that was the Bitcoin this year, Bitcoin ATM's were

actually banned. They were deemed illegal in the UK, which is just just dumb as fuck. So I think that's really stupid. And so that's that's a reverse technical innovation. So it's kind of like the worst technical innovation. I think it works. Mike, do you pre what's your worst technical innovation 2022? I'd say lack of real progress in Ethereum. Does seem like it's gone nowhere since the

merge and the price went right back down, but they still have those great Curio card NFTs. You can't beat those. But they didn't have those. I think they'd be in trouble. Let's see what I've got here. Worst technical innovation. Kevin O'Leary, Mr. Wonderful from Shark Tank gone from crypto denier to crypto believer, but he still knows nothing and goes on TV making ridiculous statements about how

everything FTX and SPF will be tracked on the blockchain. Even though we know now that they use slack disappearing messages and communicated large loan decisions by emoji, creating an undrackable web that no blockchain could ever hope to explain. And yet still this man spoke as an expert before Congress, accusing CZ of just showing destroying FTX and defending SPF who paid Leri $15 million and has seemed

to gain a lifelong friend. Though he's not technical at all. And that's the point. Mr. Wonderful is the worst technical innovation 2022. All right, Mike Dupree, enough already. What have you had enough of this year? I guess the Mt. Goc stuff finally getting figured out, but I'm getting really tired of this. I wish we get it over with already. It would be nice if they've distributed

the funds. I think I have 75 cents in there and they've sent me emails and letters for about seven years now or something. It seems like a really long time. I checked it once. I was like, wow, 75 cents. I'm going to get that. Yeah. Dan, Eve, what's your enough already? Where have you had enough of this year? Well, it's probably a slight cop out, but

I think everyone's had enough of Craig right? Right? You know, it's he's I think is he's still battling. Oh, God, God, no, goodness. He's still in hot on that. And it's going to be the K case where it's a lot. That's a good approved liable. Whereas the Norway case hot on that one easily. So yeah, yeah. But the UK one with what Bitcoin did still go

right? It's still still still going. Yep. Yep. They had another review with him recently with the Bedford shirt on. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, so I think that it's yeah, that's obviously a way past itself. Pete McCormack, that's way past itself. And also enough already. So it's an article. I don't think we we covered it. Um, but it was from the ECB, um, about three weeks ago.

And it was cool. No, it wasn't even the end. It was 30th of November. And it was called Bitcoin's last stand. And, uh, and it's a classic kind of obituary for Bitcoin. Um, but written by two like to, you know, the director of ding dog or whatever it's, you know, two, two, basically, people who work for the central or a bit bingo and Yergen Schaff. Who

work for the European central bank. And, um, enough already. Like we've, we've, we've had a bit, like surely they learn now this, there's been, there's been hundreds of obituries about Bitcoin. And it's still bounce back. Just be, I mean, these guys, they, they're not idiots. Are they, they know about market cycles. You know, when, when Amazon share price goes down, they don't go, oh, that's it.

Amazon's done for now. The share prices. It's gone down. Oh, you know, oh, meta, meta's gone now. That's completely done for the share price went down. It's, that's it. Met, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the fact is that Bitcoin lives on. It's still gains more infrastructure as the days go by. So I just think it's a really silly kind of article. And

it's almost, uh, I, I almost see them as a bit kind of, I just pity them in a way. Right. You know, they just don't get it. And it's like, it's a likes a touchy slime. And I thought initially I must have thought, I must have met. I thought it was not, I wouldn't say, um, not arrogant, but a bit kind of like unhelpful, slightly, when

it's a touchy said, um, hit me up when he said, like, if you don't get it, I'm not going to, you know, bother, you know, take the time. I can't remember paraphrasing, explaining it to you again. Um, but I get it now. It's like, you can't stop. If someone just doesn't get it, like just, you know, they're not going to get it. So you can leave

these little central bankers running, running, fiat money into the ground, printing it out of thin air and writing silly little articles about Bitcoin, which they're only writing because they can, they feel completely threatened by the fact that they're, they're, they're incapable of running monetary policy themselves. And they're probably a very envious of Bitcoin. So yeah, enough already of central banks moning about Bitcoin. It's always the

people that hate Bitcoin the most to take it during the market cycle to trash on Bitcoin, even though we can look at a longer zoom, if we zoom out, Bitcoin's lived and died about five other times, right? And it keeps coming back. But every time it goes down, they get in there to get their points on the board, how smart they were that they said Bitcoin

was going to zero. And then they keep writing those obitaries. I don't know, Dan push back a little bit. They do kind of say that met his dead all the time. Like Tesla, that's a little bit and they're like, Tesla's dead. It's out there like building cars. They have all these factories, all these people working for them. They're like, you're stock went down. You're dead. That's

the street. That's true. That's true. I suppose those are bad examples though that I gave just because met is kind of a, you know, they're very. People can very polarized about about Facebook and stuff like that. You know, you've got the people who don't like that's my dude. And the people are like, you know, Facebook's kind of okay. I agreed to give my my data away.

But, but yeah, ultimately just because the share price is, you know, dips down, especially when it's with the rest of the market, you don't say that the whole industry is collect. Well, maybe you do, maybe the problem is, it's easy to go and do, and do, and doomsday about stuff. Because people don't really kind of, people like that, that, that, that fear factor, right. They like

the idea of things breaking and exploding and falling and, and being crushed or whatever. So whilst obituary are a Bitcoin, they always sound cool. Like to some people reading them, they just, you know, they get more and more nonsensical. And as crypto cleanse point now, 467 links on the Bitcoin obituary is now 467 and they're all wrong. So, wait, you're not going to be one in

500 of being right. Like you're all going to be wrong forever. Like doomsday prophecies. You're all wrong. Because they're still here. And finally, enough already, the environmental food. The media has rediscovered this old fud like a dog with a bone and they won't give it up. They've turned a lot of environmentalists into blind Bitcoin haters when they really might prefer Bitcoin to the current system if

they only thought about it. Renewables, gas flares, plans to buy larger power systems for Africa using Bitcoin, Christmas lights, play stations, enough already. All right. Now if you're in the audience right now in the chat, this is your chance to go ahead and type in who you are. So, you think the Bitcoiner of the year should be this is the largest category here. It's a wrong

kind of drum. Oh, well. You know, I was going to give you a drum roll to have a drum beat. So here we are Bitcoiner of the year. Dan Eve, who's your pick for Bitcoiner of the year? Well, I find it always difficult picking a specific Bitcoiner of the year. So again, I'm going to twist it slightly. Well, not twist it. But I find the best

people to convince you into Bitcoin are the ones that are against it. So I'm actually going with governments and central banks are the best Bitcoiners of the year. They all win it joint because the more you learn about how government and central banks work, the more interested you are in Bitcoin, the more Bitcoin makes sense. Right. So I think that the best educators for Bitcoin are

the existing systems that Bitcoin is looking to replace. So yeah, I'm going to go for governments and central banks. I think last year I went for Peter, what's his name? Peter. Shit. Because again, you know, he hates apparently hates Bitcoin, but can't stop talking about it. And so he's getting all his, but his gold bug friends, you know, who's who he thinks he's shit, you know,

he's he's, he's, um, dissing Bitcoin too, but he's actually getting them thinking about, about Bitcoin, even more. So yeah, I think it's almost like an infiltrating destroy thing. And so the more these central banks and governments get worried about Bitcoin, the more of a positive thing is, it is for Bitcoin. Dan, going with the inverse Bitcoiner of the year. Again, Michael, do pray. Are you ready?

Who is your Bitcoiner of the year? I'm going to go with Elon Musk, even though I'm sure that's going to be controversial to some, but yeah. He's definitely get the word out about those coin. Yeah, why not? It is funny. It goes up and down every time he mentions it. But Elon, they did Tesla stops. Oh, it was this year, though, that Tesla drops 936 million

of Bitcoin, because they said, because they fell for the environmental fun thing. Right? A couple hundred million here and there, you know, small change, small change. But what's got, I think, I think as much as the the environmental fun is over. And I think we haven't really seen, we haven't even reached the beginning part or the end of the beginning of the Ethereum attack against Bitcoin,

well, the environmental side. Yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's really, recently went to proof of stake. It's been used in a few articles here and there as a stick to beat Bitcoin with. And I think that it's going to explode much more in 2023. That fun's going to come back with a vengeance because it's going to be powered by Ethereum shields. And that's where it can

do a bit more, a bit more damage, I think. That's the very same chain that has the Curio cards. Wow. All right. Here we go. Bitcoiner of the year, following a trend. The Bitcoiner of the year. Coiner of the year 2022 is Ben arc launching Ellen bits, turning into a company, spinning off Noster and helping Fiat Jeff get funding, traveling the world, teaching people in person,

how to make POS devices and so much more for this. Ben arc is the Bitcoiner of the year. All right. Mike, do you have an honorable mention for Bitcoiner of the year? Someone or someone that you think should be mentioned, but didn't get mentioned. Sure. We'll go with Jack for the honorable mention. Jack from Twitter, who quit his job to help on Bitcoin and seems to

be just kind of sitting around watching Elon burn his company down. So be a Twitter work for Twitter. There you go. All right. Jack's also doing good stuff in Africa. They had a lot of talk about him during the African Bitcoin days. And of course he funded Ben arc and Ellen bits and Fiat Jeff and all these guys. So it all ties together. Dan Eve, who

do you have for honorable mention for Bitcoiner of the year? Oh, you see, I read this completely wrong because I'm an idiot sometimes. And I thought honorable mention was just stuff that didn't fit into other categories that we've already done. So my honorable mention, I'll save the other, the honorable mentions. But if I was to off the top of my head for someone that could have

been Bitcoiner of the year, I'm going to be a big fan of it. I'm going to be a big fan of the year as an honorable mention. Well, because I didn't give it to say, I gave it to governments and central banks, I'm going to go for Ben arc. It's the honor of my honorable pick a Bitcoiner of the year. Very good, very good. Get on

the host. Good side. We all need to butter up Ben for when it gets famous in the future. All right. Honorable mention for Bitcoiner of the year 2022. I've got like a three way tie probably more coffee. Zilla autism capital coin desk, all those who covered the SBF FTX disaster with breathless intensity, like how dogs on the scent. They dug their teeth deep into the story.

And through their coverage, we were able to understand what went on far quicker than those who only watched the mainstream media and with much more in depth, the coverage. Even though they might not be Bitcoiners through their intense coverage helped defend the good name of Bitcoin and cryptocurrency. And for that, I'm going to be a big fan of Bitcoiner of the year. That reason, their honorable

mention Bitcoiners of the year 2022. But really, it's all about Ben. No one cares about honorable mention and for good reason, no points for second place. Moving on, Dan, are you ready with the story of the year? I will. But as I, as I screwed up the questions, you see, so my honorable mentions of just stuff to honorably mention in general, apparently, was okay. Another year,

another 100% uptime from Bitcoin, like 100% uptime. You know, that's, that's even, whenever you go and pay for it, even the most expensive of service services, you know, they will never show you 100% uptime because it's near impossible to do. And Bitcoin does that. So I think it's fantastic. 100% uptime. Another honorable mention actually read a recent one of an event, which I kind of liked.

Was the sad listing of BSV from BitFinex along with other coins like Celsius. And BSV people were very unhappy about that, because they didn't want to get bundled in the failed projects like Celsius bag or scam projects. So yeah. So that was my honorable mention because I misunderstood the wording. And the story of the year is a selfish one for me. But it's, it's been, because

I've had a lot of new baby this year, Theo, and it's just been really, really fun. And so yeah, that's my, my, my, my, my story of the year is, is, is my little boy, Theo, and watching him grow up and interact with my other son. I think it's, yeah, that's just been really, really fun. And a nice break from just thinking about crypto 2477. Maybe

Theo, a real Homer pick there from Dan. Also, they're saying in the chat that mad Bitcoin should be Bitcoin or the year. I agree with you. Michael Dupree, story of the year. What was the biggest story in 2022? Ah, I don't know on this one. This one's a tough one. Um, I guess the biggest story to me. I'll go back to Tesla and say with them

buying and selling Bitcoin and trading. It was pretty substantial. Mainstream kind of event going on. A major event in Bitcoin no doubt. But my story of the year is the same thing I've been saying all night. FTX, Sam Bankman, Fried and Caroline Ellison's Frankenstein Monster tore through the entire Bitcoin industry with a vengeance this year, causing dominoes to fall in all directions, not only destroying the

price of Bitcoin and all cryptos, the story, which was part in part launched by coin desk, whose story exposing FTX may now collapse their parent company DCG, which is reeling from lost funds, loaned out to SPF to bet on margin trading. It has been a wild year. It can only be topped by next year. FTX collapse is the story of the year for 2022. All right.

Anything that we missed, anything else we need to mention. Go ahead, Dan. Well, I was going to say what's what's the latest on that. So, so from my reading. So SPF was was being extradited here. He was he was unhappy about his lack of vegan food in the in the in the in the in the the It sounds like he had he had pretty sweet vegan

food at the bottom is held. They kept him in the the infirmary in the first aid type section. He was allowed a laptop, a television. They say that he read articles about himself said, Mary Christmas to the guards on his way out. Generally had a pretty sweet setup there. He did change his mind at first. He was going to battle the extradition, which many assumed meant

that he was in one of those horrible cells. And and then he was like, Oh, no. I've changed my mind. I'm not battling it anymore. Get me out of the horrible cell. But it actually looks like he had a might had a pretty nice time. Then they extradited him back to New York to the United States, the Southern District of New York has charged him with

financial crimes. We found out that Caroline Ellison and I think Gary Feng, I might guys name wrong. But those two former employees of his have turned against him both pleading guilty to an incredible amount of potential time, which they hope they can work off with their participants. They were both released with a mere $250,000 bail. Sam Bankman freed allegedly raised even at 10%. It would be

he was charged with $250 million. The largest bail ever, I think somebody was reporting. I couldn't think one bigger. I tried to think of like, you know, gangsters and murderers and so forth. And I couldn't think of a bigger one. But allegedly, he raised it. Usually bail is about 10%. So he raised 25 million or in actuality what they say is that his parents, his aunt,

a family friend, all put their houses as collateral for the bond. So I read that. I read that. It's four million. So there's still 21 million left. Yeah, I heard four million parents house, I think. Yeah. So that's still a huge amount like. But let's face it. It's not like he couldn't. I mean, the idea of him saying. Oh, I've only got $100,000 left. Like that's

just ludicrous. Like, yeah, let's, let's face it. Although Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies are extremely traceable because they're on a blockchain. There's no way in hell that he doesn't have like. What's of coinage like here there and everywhere. You know, the fake company structure. I was saying, sorry, I don't know. It's allegedly fake company structures that helped facilitate all these crazy wood and money moving everywhere. As if

there's not a huge amounts floating around. And. You know, of course, he would find donors that would suddenly like give him money out of thin air. You know, who would want to give money to the someone who's like, you know, the one of the biggest fraudsters in history. So all a bit crazy. I think. The problem with the Bitcoin is that the bail bonds people won't

accept stolen Bitcoin. So he had to have planned ahead turn that into money actually had an account. Sometimes even your account. Get frozen for someone like the alleged dread pirate robberess Ross, Oh, Brett, you would think he would have already had an account with a law firm already paid the money put it on retainer and been prepared for this possibility. As same as S B F.

But it doesn't look like he did that. And it didn't it looks like it's his parents who are apparently very well off his aunt who's well off and a family friend who's well off who have given this the most bizarre Christmas imaginable. Who would think. That after allegedly stealing or misplacing or losing around $8 billion worth of funds that Sam Bankman Fried will be spending Christmas

at home in his family house. It's just disgraceful. It's hardly a deterrent. Is it like to for for people if you commit and say, you know, he may go to jail, but just to be treated like he's not a complete criminal. Like I wish. I wish they would they were. And it was a show like, you know, how they used to it was it who Michael

Moore covered it. That's it. Michael Moore was like, instead of having cops, you need corporate cops where they like bust in bad boys, bad boys, what's it going to do. You know, and like take take out Sam Bankman free not take him out like that. But you know, like as in you know, drag him out with Cafson and like treating with the same like I mean,

what they should do in this scenario, right. It's like, you know how badly they treat someone who steals a packet of crisps like the police drag him out. They probably end up losing a team. The tooth or whatever, you know, in a scuffle. So this man stole seven billion packets of crisps. Right. So, uh, so like treat him like he's stolen seven billion packets of crisps.

Like don't treat don't treat him with kid gloves and and like flirt with him over Twitter about coming to the Senate and whatever. Oh, you should do. You know, like, they're not of that stuff. Like this guy's this guy's a terrible terrible criminal and treat him like one. I just think it's it's nuts. This. Crazy. I also had reports on Twitter that he was kind of

rushed through the courtroom process. He was fitted with an ankle bracelet and he was back out on the street by like 230. And the guy said he'd never seen an extradition or a hearing like this. Go so fast. It was almost like fast track just to make it easy. So we could get home in time for Christmas. Uh, Michael, do you think about this if a

Mark Carpellis was just having Christmas with the family after the Mt. Gox thing, not not even worried just you know out on bail. Living it up. I think he did end up on bail eventually, but uh, yeah, I don't know, man, it's a lot of people's harder and money these guys are talking about. So I'd like to think though at least that with time that he'll

get, you know, get to face the music. On so many other people who do much less like if you're caught for drunken public or something and you're there on the weekend, you have to spend the weekend in jail. And I think it sucks. Like it would be really bad. Now it doesn't seem like for SPF that this has happened. They could have arranged this. It's at

a the courts closed, you know, we messed up. We can't process your documents fast enough and stuck them in jail for Christmas. They could have arranged this, but it feels more and I hate to say it. It feels like the Epstein and the jail Maxwell case where larger hands are guiding the trial and so forth. So I don't know if he, if he runs, if he

destroys his parents with a $250 million bond on their head. Does he take care of himself? Does he show up for court? What do you guys think? What's, and I think Mike's also got the future prediction down there. Carpellis got off. What's to say that this guy doesn't get off to like let's just say he just completely gets away with it back on the street. Running

another company, a job with a friend, Dan Eve, predict the future of SPF. Well, isn't he potentially, he's going to be potentially serving him like 105 years or something, but how likely he's been charged with like seven counts. It includes wire fraud. Caroline and the other guy Gary, they both pled guilty to 70 and 100 years of potential charges. Presumably they'll get some that time. They'll

get back for, for ratting out Sam, but for Sam, there seems no one else to rat out. So he, you might have to take the fall on this. But surely he, okay, he, he must be, you know, he was the co owner of like Alameda, right? So, surely he can technically he can still dub. Like grass on Caroline for dealings that happen in there. I mean,

it sounds like a crazy scenario where the first person to, to, to grass on someone. Just gets like let off like surely you can't, you know, you can't, I don't know, you can't just like, that's just a stupid way of doing it, right? You know, whoever grass is first, because then it's still not really justice. It's just kind of a shortcut to semi justice. So it

sounds like you're defending mob bosses now, because you know, that's how they get the mob bosses. They get the little people to snitch. And yeah, the little get off with very light sentences. And then they hammer down on the mob boss, because they're trying to prove to people to try to say, hey, don't, don't be a mob boss. Don't do these things. Wow, it doesn't sound

like he's gonna, if he's already avoiding even spending a night in US jail. And he gets to go home with his little ankle bracelet and spent Christmas with his family when someone who's probably like pisses, pisses against a wall is going to spend two days in jail. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not expecting much, but you know, he should, he should bloody well, okay. He's time. You

know, your average wall, wall pisser can't come up with $25 million in bail, but it's got to work on for next time. Mike, I might have to go back to Dan for another answer. What do you think will happen in the future of SBF? I, I don't know, but it's certainly going to be interesting. And I think that there'll be a lot more regulation that comes

out of this for other similar exchanges and operations. He will definitely have an effect. And then Dan, what do you think was he going to go to jail? Do you think he'll go to trial? He'll take care of himself. Oh, it's difficult. What is it? They were saying that there was rumors that he was going to be staying in the same like complex or whatever is,

is Epstein, but apparently that's, that's actually our action now. It's under under maintenance or something like that. It seems like he, you know, he, he, he's not going to be able to do that. Is the sort of guy that he obviously has a lot of connections. You know, there's lots of pictures of him posing with, with people that seem pretty powerful. So he's probably got a

lot of people on his side that he can probably, you know, he's done a lot of favors for. But at the same time, he probably has a lot of dirt on people and their finances, right? So I don't know. I think, unfortunately, I think he may get it. I say unfortunately, oh, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, he may get Epstein,

you know, and and not see the full fight of the the justice system. But at the same time, you know, he may just kind of get get away lightly with it by dobbling in other people or threatening to and then just like, you know, I think that's a really good thing. And then sort of getting, you know, getting a lighter touch because he's got dirt on

others. So I'm not so sure it would be a fake thing if it happened to him. I think this guy should be kept away from shoe laces and all other manners of things. But now he's out and about in his parents house, which, you know, could be filled with chain saws or legally purchased handguns and so forth. I just think it's very the things he's done.

Once he, if he ever realizes what he's done, how many people's futures he's ruined. You know, we go back to morals and ethics and the altruism thing that he used to talk about all of those things are back on the table. But I do think it's kind of funny to think about this like the end of the Tom Cruise movie risky business. He's basically just run

a whorehouse to get college admissions and by allowing one of the admission guys in. He's into school. And he kind of kicks back in bed. He's like, everything worked out for me. And I think about this SBF guy. He started out in this little bedroom in his parents room. He's probably got his posters and all this stuff still on the wall. And he goes out and

he travels the world. He goes to the Bahamas and he has a polycule. He has a giant apartment. He has all these billions of dollars. And then pretty soon he's back at this apartment again. He's back at this little room back on his, you know, little bed with his little plaid, you know, his plaid comforter. And his pictures of LeBron James and sports stars and whatever.

And I just, I can't imagine what goes through that guy's head. What a, what a ride. It's been what a good. It'll make even if whatever the ending is, it's going to be a bomb. Great movie. We'll have to see how it turns out. But I think we're running out of time. So just thanks to everybody for joining us this year, given us the thumbs up

doing the subscribe. Thanks to everybody in the chat. We appreciate you guys are kind of like stadler and wall door. Like sometimes you don't agree with us. But you know, I think it's a great thing. You enjoy coming back and chatting it up. You have the palm palms to make this a spectacular. You guys want to predict against the ball. Yeah. Or rolling. Okay. So Dan

Eve, this time next week, higher or lower the price of Bitcoin. Okay. So I'm wrong. Most weeks. So I'm actually, oh, no, I was right last week. Cause I said down. It's down 0.52%. But I think we're going to be lower again. I think there's, there's going to be a bit of a December end of December. Sell off people probably paying taxes for gearing up to

pay taxes in January and whatever. So yeah, I think I think we're going to go a bit lower. Like to pre higher or lower this time next week. Lower. I always guess lower. I'm a pessimist. Oh, the pessimism is everywhere in this Christmas season. Let's see what the ball thinks. As you guys know, this is the baldest and most greatest source of truth for Bitcoin prediction.

This is people use this to plant all their charts. Will the price of Bitcoin be high? Yeah. So we're going to be higher this time next week. Here we go. Very suspenseful. You may rely on it. You may rely on it. So the ball is positive looking into the Christmas season. But thanks again to everybody for joining us and commenting and chatting and sharing the show

and everything else. It's been fun to do the show this year. Thanks to all the panelists who've been onto the show. Thanks to Marwee for helping us organize the show. And getting us guests. Thanks to Mike and Dan for being here at the end of the year right before Christmas. I think that's about anything else to be forgot to say Dan. No, but in two days

time, think of me when X is my birth. I share or shall I say some guy from apparently 2000 years ago shares a birthday with a very special person called me. So, oh, so after years of hating Christmas, well, I've now got a little too. See little kids that who love Christmas again. It's kind of I like the, you know, I'm starting to grow on me

again. So I even help put up the tree this year. So Christmas. All the cards say they say happy birthday to Jesus and Dan. Mike, do you free anything you want to say in closing? God. Happy holidays, everybody. Good to see you Thomas. All right, Merry Christmas. Happy holidays, everybody. Hope you have a good time with your family. Hope you're not out traveling this horrible snowpock

lips. But we'll be back probably next week. If people are around, might take a week off. We'll see. But I hate taking a week off. It's allows us to show must go on. It's right. Show must go on. So until next time, bye.