Nigel Travis - Leyton Orient FC Chairman - The Bus

Mark Cuban. How you do anything is how you do everything. If you're not, you don't pay attention to detail on the little things, you're not going to be in the habit of paying attention to details for the big things. Ken Griffey Jr. Hey, where's his hat back? First, well, where my hat back is because my dad had a fro and I wonder where his hat. And

if I put his hat on at 86 and you know, he's got a eight and a half and I got like a loaf five, it's not going to really stay on my head. Genea Buss. Thank you for having me. Let a nice turnout. It's good to see everybody. John Smoltz. If you don't have the imagination and the willingness to fail or not being afraid to fail,

I don't think you can be truly great. Candace Parker. I have so much hope for this generation coming up that I've grown up with women in sports, in leadership roles, on television, speaking about sports, speaking knowledgeably about sports. To me, all the work that I've done, I'll look at my tearing work that I've done. As always, giving me great perspective has allowed me to keep my

feet on the ground and has really put and reminded me what's truly important. That was for Seattle. Just to name a few. Welcome to sports business radio. Now here's Brian Burger. Thanks for joining us on sports business radio. We're doing part two of our look inside of European football last week. I sat down with Martin Ling, the director of football operations for latent or it this

week. Nigel Travis, the chairman and co-owner of latent orient joins me. We get a rare look from the owner of a European football club. That's going to be great. I had a chance to embed with latent or it last week. I told you I was going to in a way match. By the way, latent or it. Two wins. No losses. No goals allowed with Brian Burger

in attendance. I think they're going to want to have me back. They did well while I was in attendance. Nigel Travis and the team at latent orient rolled out the red carpet for me. I'll tell you what. I learned a lot about the business of European football. So many things that I didn't know before this trip that I learned from Martin and Nigel. I think if

you're paying attention, you're going to learn a lot. As well. Nigel has also been the chairman of Duck the Dundes, Baskin Robbins. He sits on the board at Abur, Cromby. He's led Blockbuster, Ferbard King, Papa John. He's worked with some big brands. He knows how to run business. And it just so happened to latent orient was his team growing up as a young boy. So now

he owns them. How fool would it be for all of us to own the team that we grew up watching. So I think you're going to enjoy this conversation. I'm joined by executive producer Brian Greeks from across the pond. Greeks. How are you doing? Good. Yeah. And yeah, I love Nigel. I mean, talk about a resume. He's he's basically worked with every brand you've ever heard

of in every story you've ever been to. He's been a part of it. So Nigel's great. Love listening to his accent and his behind the look of his team and how cool. Yeah. Owning the team that you grow up as a fan of. I mean, that's like iconic. I love it. And it was really cool. Because I went in Manimedes flat, beautiful flat. We rode in

the car and saw some sights, including I think it's Lord's stadium. It's one of the most famous cricket fields in the world here in London. You know, we just had a nice chat. It was the first time we met in person. We'd only spoken on the phone before. You know, he lives in the States part time as well. So he has a really rare perspective is

someone who, you know, knows the business of American sport. Well, he's friends with Jerry Jones and Robert Traft and Stephen Ross and, you know, a lot of people. But then also obviously has the perspective of someone who's running a European football club. Pretty reprospective that we're going to get today from Nigel. But I can't thank him enough for rolling out the red carpet. I got to

go to dinner with Nigel and the coaching staff after their match at home. So it was just a great day. And, you know, like I said, they rolled out the red carpet for me and I thanked them. Greg, this has been such an interesting time to be in London. Queen Elizabeth, the second, died at age 96. She was, you know, in power for 70 years. So,

I mean, I saw so many things while I was here. I went to Buckingham Palace. I said last week, I went to Westminster Abbey. I didn't get to go in, but I saw the outside. I wasn't there for the funeral. But, you know, I saw a lot of the sites, Big Ben Parliament. If you've seen your PNVK with Chevy Chase, I saw Big Ben Parliament. How

is this going to impact England? I mean, there were moments of silence everywhere. There were programs that had the queen on the cover. I went to the Arsenal Brandford game, which I'll get to in a minute. And, you know, during the 70th minute to honor her 70 years of reign. They every year, they're going to be in the same place. They're going to be in the

same place. So, I mean, she was so revered here. And basically, the mother and grandmother of England. But, Greg, King Charles, now, like, the money here is going to change. The stamps are going to change. Like, everything has to be re-branded. Who had someone who was in power for 70 years. So, now it all gets re-branded and changed. It's crazy. Yeah. I think that's the thing

that just keeps getting me like, I mean, I'm going to be in the same place. You know, in the US, we're used to a president for four years or eight years. Big deal. 70 years. I mean, everybody knows her because every generation that's alive and over there has dealt with Queen Elizabeth as their queen. So, it's like, she's everywhere. And you mentioned it on the money,

on the banks, on the everything. I mean, it's going to be quite a process. But, yeah, 70 years, it's still just I can't understand that. It's crazy. How about this? During her reign, 70 years, she met 18 US presidents. So, there were 18 US presidents during her 70 years of reign. I mean, you want to talk about someone who saw it all and we'll never see

anything like this again. There's never anyone in our lifetime who are probably for the rest of time that will be in power for 70 years and rule over a nation for 70 years. That's unaffirmed. And, you know, a queen nonetheless. And, you know, such a strong woman and you know, she was so revered here. You know, one of the things that I saw a picture, the

lines were five miles long. And they eventually had to shut them down to go see her line in state. That's how many people. I mean hundreds of thousands of people. But one of the people who got in the back of the line to the morning and waited 14 hours in line. David Beckham. And I'll tell you what, I've got a lot of respect for David Beckman

after doing that because there were some sort of things that I wanted to do. So, I won't mention who used their celebrity to, let's say, it to the front of the line. But David Beckham put on a little tap and he put jacket and was pretty in card, Nito. And he stood in line for 14 hours, starting at 2 a.m. To honor the queen and pay

his respect. So, I thought that was pretty amazing. I did not go into the hub of where everything was going on for the funeral itself. I did what I wanted to do. I walked in on BBC. And it was interesting. All the businesses were closed here. This was basically holiday today. You go to the storefront. And it had a picture, which I tweeted out at S.V.

Radio of, you know, we're closed to honor her majesty, the queen Elizabeth. But things basically shut down. No school, the banks were closed. Most of the stores were closed. But, you know, I don't even know what I could relate it to. You know, I wasn't alive for the time. It's a kind of assassination. But you hear that things shut down for that funeral. And I don't

know what you would relate it to in America. But this was something, like I said, we'll never see the likes of this guy. I love the respect that they have over there for the majesty and just the whole system. It's just feel like people are just, they follow it. They respect it. Like you said, they closed the nation down when there's a tragedy. I love that,

that, you know, respect that you see from the European nation. Sometimes we don't see that as much in America because people are doing so many times. And it's kind of a hundred billion different things. But over there, it's like, it shut down. We're going to respect this. Well, and she cut across politics, right? I mean, the royals that she, she's seen so many prime ministers. Like

I said, she's dealt with so many US presidents and leaders around the world. She was the one constant. So, you know, pretty amazing to see. And I had no idea I was going to be here during this store time. But like I said, it impacted a lot of the sports events. Some being postponed, some being canceled. She was honored at all of the events. Like I

said, free game during the math in the 70th minute in the magazines. You know, a lot of respect paid to the queen. All right. I went to my first Premier League match. And Griggs, you know, I've done the Major League soccer before and it's good soccer. But I always wanted to go to a Premier League. You know, you watch it on TV. And you're like, wow,

this is, this is like the Ferrari of soccer. And I'm not a huge soccer fan. But I respect the game. It's a little bit boring for me at times. You know, I'm used to fast paced basketball, high scoring American football. You know, I love home runs and baseball. I'm a scoring guy. But I respect the skill and the strategy of soccer for football, as it's called

over here. Going to see Arsenal and Brentford. And by the way, Brentford Stadium brand new built last year, beautiful little 17,000 seat modern venue. And then Arsenal, who is in first place, the top, the Premier League right now. So I was seen the best team in Premier League. He was like a symphony of soccer is the best way I can put it with Arsenal. They control

the ball beautifully. Every single pass, every header, every, you know, kick from the goal. Leotall has a purpose. They're always in control. Frankly, they dominated the match. Brentford probably got maybe three clean looks on goal the entire match. So they were dominant defensively. They were dominant offensively. And then, you know, I'm at the match with my new friend Nile who took me to the match. And

I snaked Nile for for doing that. And, you know, he's telling me how Arsenal has all of these players on their bench that would probably start for Brentford. And, you know, they're making millions and millions of dollars. That's another interesting thing. When people over here talk at the pubs about how much an athlete makes like we'll say, you know, LeBron James is making 45 million dollars

a year. Over here, they'll say so and so is making, you know, $495,000 a week. Everything's a week over here. It's not for a year. So that's an interesting difference. But okay, here are some other things. Difference is between America and England and how we speak. And all right. So watch your step. You know, you get an awful bus here, getting off subway. You're in an

arena or a stadium. Watch your step in America. In England, Griggs. And I'm going to have this. I'll take my head like for years now. Mind the gap. Mind the gap. What I'm on the Underground. It probably says mind the gap at every stop. Mind the gap. Mind the gap. So I love mind the gap. It's like I need to get a t-shirt that says mind

the gap. I love it that much. I really want mind the gap. In America, we call it a beer. Over here, everyone says, let's go for a pint. Right. Okay. Um, you know, I think you should have a drink with me in America. Um, you know, we're going to make a big deal of beer. I'm going to drink beer with you. So let's think about it

and I'm going to get a beer. You and I are friends in England, we're mates. Yep. Just like in Australia. Um, people say hello or goodbye in America. Over here. Cheers. Okay. Um, in America, we call people an idiot. Over here. You're a wanker. I love that one. Now sports. You've got fans in America. Fanatics fans. Over here. You're a supporter. So you've got the supporters

section and the supporters and I'll get to that in a minute. Um, we call it a football field or a soccer field or a baseball field over here. It's a pitch. That pitch is 200 years old. By the way, they do have pitches over here that are older than America. By the way. Like a lot older. Yeah. America. So when you come over here or I've

been to China, you go to Japan. I mean, you see just how young America. We're a newborn baby compared to these other nations that have been around for so much longer. And then, you know, we'll say someone won the soccer game. Three or nothing. Three to zero. Over here. It's nil. Yeah. Renew. So those are some of the differences. One of the things that we'll talk

about with Nigel. And this just blew me away great. Okay. So in the 70s and 80s. And I kind of remember this but wasn't really clear on it until this week. There were all kinds of basically riots that broke out at football matches. And people were hurt and stadiums collapsed. And I mean, there was lots of stuff going on. And the other thing I've noticed is

the people in Europe, they got tempers. Like they want to fight. They wanted to throw it out. They, you know, go to the local pub and and they're much more willing to throw down than Americans are, I think. Like if you had a European and American and a brawl, the European is going to probably smoke the American for easily. Is my guess. But there were some

rules here that blew me away. Number one, when you go to a football stadium like when I went to Arsenal, Brent for the other day, the match was at Brentford. Brentford gets an allotment of home seats. And then Arsenal has their own section. And Griggs, there's walls that basically come up in the away section. So that none of the whole fan and the away fans can

mix thus getting a fight. Right. So they totally segregate the whole fans from the away fans. And what happened is if you, you know, you know, I'm going to say, I'm going to throw it out. The away fans don't sell all their tickets. Well, the home team can't say, oh, we've got more tickets that we can sell and make money on. Let's sell those tickets. No,

you just have to basically eat those tickets because you can't mix the home and away supporters. So Arsenal sold out their section and included in their section. Griggs, I tweeted out a picture at SB radio. And I didn't see him with my own eyes. I just learned about this afterwards. Ted Lasso actors. Ted Lasso himself and coach feared Brendan Hunt. They were in the Arsenal section

at the Arsenal, Brentford match. But that was all sold out. Now the other thing that was interesting is if you're going to an away match, they cap it at 20 pounds, which is basically like $25. I mean, can you imagine like in America, if you're like, well, I can't get tickets to the Lakers or nicks at home. So I'm going to go on the road and

watch them. And the most time and I have to pay it's $25. Not bad. Not bad at all. So segregation of the fans, I had no idea. And then the other thing in this blew me away. Because I thought, again, you hear about the drinking that takes place over here. You can't drink in the seating bowl. I mean, can you imagine going to an American football

game and NBA game or maybe like baseball game and, you know, the people who are selling beers and stands. You can't do that here. You can drink before the game and you can drink at halftime and you can drink after, but you can't drink during the game and you can't drink in the seating bowl. So you're losing a ton of revenue. If you own one of

these soccer clubs, I mean in America, that's one of the biggest forms of revenue is alcohol sales. And how many times will we watch an NBA game and we see like the person bringing the drinks and the ball comes in the person in the drinks go fly. Like you would never see that here. Because you're not allowed to sell beer in the seating bowl. So those

two things, the segregation of the fan and basically the home team having to eat the tickets. If the away team doesn't sell their tickets and the away tickets being capped at a certain price within really low. I mean, if I was someone I couldn't get season tickets to my home team, I would just go watch all the road matches. Hey, $25.20. That's a really good deal.

But okay, going back to Brentford Arsenal, I just thought, I'm not going to say it was a religious experience for me, but it made me appreciate soccer more so than I had before. And, the immense strategy, the concert of controlling the ball with your head, with your foot, the goalie, everything had a strategy to it. And when you watch Arsenal, like I tweeted out, it was

like watching a Ferrari operating on all cylinders. I mean, everyone was in concert with each other. No one was like doing anything sillier. And this isn't like basketball where it's five on five. Like you've got, you know, multiple players out there and everyone's got to be on the same page. They're in concert with the coach. I love the job Richie Wellens does with late Norean. They're

in league two. So they're down a couple levels from the Arsenal. But I mean, one of the other things is Brentford was at the same level as late Norean 10 years ago. So again, as we discussed in our show last week, Griggs, the promotion relegation. It's huge because you can be down at level four and you can aspire to be up to level one. And you

can be at level one. And you can go, oh my God, I don't want to get relegated. I don't want to get out of the level two or three or four. And there's a lot of money as you have here. Nigel discussed in our conversation that goes with getting promoted, right? You get TV money. There's other forms of revenue. But there's also more costs. You know,

in America, we say more money, more problems. Well, you got to pay it. And the buyers wore, you know, like the other day, Arsenal has a $163 million payroll. And Brentford has like a $60 million payroll. And 10 years ago, they probably had like a $2.5 million payroll. So to them $60 million is a lot. But they're not in the same universe as Arsenal. And for

American listeners, I would say the closest thing I can compare it to is Major League Baseball, right? You've got the Yankees, the Red Sox, the Dodgers. paying hundreds of millions of dollars. And you've got the A's and the Kansas City Royals and the Florida Marlins paying tens of millions of dollars, right? Like, you know, Ronaldo makes more by himself than the entire Brentford FC football club

does. You know, and we remember the stats of like, you know, A-Rod makes more than the entire roster of the Oakland A's or the Florida Marlins. So it's very similar. Yeah, it's a, it's an a crazy, it's crazy. Just how different it is. Like you're saying, and you got to see in person, the whole event, you know, the stadium, how you get there, how you pay

for what you drink, how you eat, it's just, it's a whole different world. And I'm glad you got to go. Pictures were amazing. The field looked like it was just in pristine shape and condition, which of course it is. And yeah, I kind of, I likened it back to when I was a kid. I loved growing up with our local hockey team. And then I went

to an NHL game for the first time. I'm like, holy crap. These guys are every passes on every single hit is on. Every single, it's just so orchestrated. Like you say, it's like a symphony. And that's cool. You got to see it. Yeah. I love the guys who come out and manage the pitch too. They come out. Like they've got these little pitch for. It reminds

me of like the grounds keepers at Augusta National. Yeah. They keep it in pristine condition. And I mean, so by the time you get on to this field, it's just like it's beautiful. Yeah. And you know, at the again, the Premier League. It's like basically playing soccer or at a Augusta National Golf Course. I mean, you are playing on the nicest field in the nicest stadiums.

Yeah. And you know, it was good. So again, I think you're going to enjoy this conversation with Nigel Travis. I want to get to a few headlines from America or internationally. I'm having to cut my trip short. Unfortunately, my mother has taken ill. So I'm returning to the States early to help take care of her. But, in the next few days in London, Roger Federer, who

just announced his retirement is playing in his last competitive matches at Lavercup. So Roger Federer to me, I've had the privilege of seeing him play in person. He's more of the great tennis player diver. I think he's as gifted as any tennis player ever. He's such a class act. You know, he looks like a ballerina playing tennis. I mean, he's just so graceful and is every

shot in the book. So, I wish him well. I'm sorry. I'm going to miss him in London. It would have been cool to try and get a press pass and go watch him play in his last matches. But, you know, when I remember Roger Federer, I'm going to remember him in the same ilk as Serena Williams. I mean, for my money in my lifetime. And I've

seen a lot of tennis player. Bjorn Borg, John McEnroe, for Sievert, Artina Navratzlova. For my money, the two of you guys are playing in the same game. You greatest tennis players that I walked with my own two eyes, or Roger Federer and Serena Williams. Yeah. Federer is so smooth. Like he said, he's smoother than a McEnroe was kind of all over the place. You know, great

player, but played a whole different style. Federer is just so everything is just orchestrated. Swing is beautiful. And like you say, he's a class act. He's with the kids always. He's signing autographs. He's a great interview. He's just a fun guy. And I think, man, he's going to be missed on the court. But yeah, he's fun to watch over the years for sure. His matchups with

Nadal were just classic. I mean, that one at Wimbledon a few years ago was maybe the greatest tennis match ever played. You know, you saw he and Nadal and Gokovic stay. They played at the highest of levels. Tennis history. And we got to see that in our lifetimes. That's pretty cool. A few more headland. Robert Sarver, the owner of the Phoenix Sun. He has been fine

$10 million suspended for a year. Many people, including myself, don't think that that was harsh enough. Robert Sarver has been a guest on the show a few times. I read the report and was sick and like most others. And you know, LeBron James has come out and said the penalty wasn't harsh enough. Chris Paul who plays for the Sun said the penalty wasn't harsh enough. And

there's no room in the league for, you know, accents like Sarvers. And then PayPal has come out and said they're going to end their life. And they're sponsorship if Sarver doesn't resign. So Griggs, as we know, from doing this show for a long time, money talks. And when sponsors start dropping their sponsorships with the Suns and the NBA and players like LeBron James and Chris Paul

first ballot hallfamers come out and say, Hey, this was not harsh enough. Then things might change. Now if you want to know the real reason that the penalty wasn't more harsh than it was. And then the reason why I think the penalty was not harsh enough is because of litigation and discovery. And you know that Sarver and his team of lawyers would have sued the NBA

if they tried to take the team away from him. So, you know, just like we saw in the DM Snyder, you know, report and the John Gruden emails came out of that. You know, there's all these other reports going on. Like I don't think the NBA wanted that. But I think that's what I'm saying. They're going to have to deal with the backlash of putting out

a penalty that most saw is not harsh enough. I mean 99% of people on my Twitter timeline were saying, this is a joke. This isn't harsh enough. I mean, you read some of the things that he did in that report. I don't know where there is a place for someone like that and the NBA. And again, I've had him on the show. And he's always been

nice to me. But obviously he was the same with others. And, you know, there's no room for that. Yeah, definitely no room for it. I agree with you. I think he needs to resign and just be done. Obviously he's going to be known for this. We talk about that too. You know, these guys can have these dynasties of perfection, their whole career. And then when it's

something like this comes out, that's all we're going to remember him by. And that's that's bad on him and what he'll deal with. But yeah, I think the the fine line of the we talk about with all the other leagues, you know, when someone needs to be punished, how do they do it? What's their formulation of how this needs to happen and how far it needs

to be done? I agree with you. I think it's under on this one. I think it needs to be way harder. And hopefully he'll just resign and kind of disappear from the leagues and, you know, the sporting world because it's just nasty. Yeah. All right. Last thing to discuss with American headlines, the NFL college football, Greg's year there. I'm sure you watch games that I watch.

I light on social media. You know, the Miami dolphins are two and out to a six touchdowns. And, you know, the great game with Lamar Daxon 42 38 final score. The Jets came out of nowhere and came back against the Browns, the Arizona Cardinals came out of nowhere and came back against the Raiders. So a lot of comebacks. And, you know, then you look at the

Cincinnati Bengals went to the Super Bowl. Why was that game? And they're owing to and they can't protect Joe Burr. So they've gone from the penthouse to the outhouse pretty quickly. And then Jimmy. Ciroplow boy, aren't the Niners happy that they signed him as the backup and didn't trade him because now trade lands is out for the season. They just turned over the keys to the

quarterback position to him. He gets hurt gone for the season. Now you got Jimmy G, who knows that offense, those that coaching staff, who knows that roster and your season isn't lost after two games. So, yeah, this is why if you have a chance to sign the backup, you sign a good backup. Because if you're going to be a good guy, you're going to be a

good guy. If your starter goes down early in the season, your season could be over. Yeah. Jimmy came in there like he hadn't missed a beat. He did. I mean, he came in like he'd been playing on long. So that's a huge, huge up for them. You feel bad for trade lands. Obviously getting this first start for the season and then getting, you know, the broken

ankle. But, yeah, yesterday, definitely the comeback Sunday. There was some crazy games and two funny thing about him six touchdowns. He also had two picks. He could have thrown eight TDs in that game. I mean, he had he had a chance to throw eight of them and it didn't work. But, you know, and you see Kyler Murray on that two point conversion that won the game.

He was in the pocket for 20 seconds, running around and just get, you know, how he is video game style. And then he runs it in and they win the game. So that was crazy. So in a Phil's parody, we talked about all the time. And it's so hard to repeat. We're seeing that was sincere. They look like they don't even know what they're doing. And

it's just crazy. How many different teams, you know, the trade guys in this guy and this guy and new quarterback, New Diamond. And it can change the whole, you know, the whole next season. So it's always fun to watch. By the way, Jimmy Garoppolo's contract with the Niners. If he takes 25% of the snaps, which he will as long as he stays healthy, he gets a

bonus of $250,000 per game. And he gets $350,000. So another hundred, 350 total if the Niners win. So this past game, he took 25% of the steps. So we got his 250 NA one. So he made $350,000. So, you know, they signed him to a pretty team friendly contract. They probably thought, all right, he's going to sit on the bench all year and look forward. Well,

now they're going to be paying him. And they're going to be paying him pretty sizable money. But I'm sure they're happy to pay him if he wins, right? Oh, yeah. I think I love the contract. All these different things written into it. That's a cool little tidbit. You bring up there because, yeah, I mean, he's going to play the rest of season as long as he's

healthy. So he's going to end up pretty well after the this year for sure. Right. I want to thank again Nigel Travis and late Norean FC for hosting me. They went above and beyond. And then giving me access, taking me on the team bus, stayed in hotel with them, went to the strategy meetings, you know, hung out with Nigel. It is flat and rode in the

car with him to the match. I had dinner with the team after the game. Just a class act organization. Can't thank them enough. I think our listeners benefit from really getting to peak under the hood of European football. Just how different it is from American sports. So I think you're going to enjoy the conversation coming up next with Nigel Travis, Chairman and co-owner of late and

boring. You're listening to Sports Business Radio. We'll be right back. Hey, everyone. Brian Berger here. Ron is the new official menswear partner of sports business radio. I love their product. I've been a fan for a long time. Did you know, David Stern was one of their first investors. Ron makes the absolute highest quality best fitting and most comfortable performance driven clothing for men. Their entire line

places emphasis on an active balanced and purpose driven lifestyle. I'm wearing my spa joggers. I've got them in Heather Gray. I've got them in Navy. I've got my Moleskin commuter slim pant. I've got my regular black commuter pant. I've got my dress shirts. So when I'm out in Indian, I'm going to be wearing my black dress shirt. In person meetings, I have the nicer Ron product

to wear. But most of the time I'm working for home. And I've got my rain long sleeve gray Heather camo. I've got my rain long sleeve hoodies. I am wearing the shorts for workouts. The seven inch Mako shorts. So I'll tell you what from top to bottom, whether it's casual or business wear Ron has me covered. I know they're going to have you covered too. Ron

is offering sports business radio podcast listeners 15% off your purchase. Go to Ron.com rho ne.com and enter code sbr 15 at checkout like sports business radio 15 sbr 15 at checkout. Receive 15% off your purchase. That's Ron.com rho ne.com and enter promo code sbr 15 at checkout. All right, everyone, I am still in London. And I just took in another latent Orient match. And last week,

we focused on the business of football. And the roster with Martin Lang, the director of football. Now I'm with the chairman of latent Orient. Also a previous gas done sports business radio. He has worked as the chair at Duncan, a baskin robins blockbuster. You're on the board of Abercrombie. Lots of different American companies as well. Nigel Travis, thanks for hosting me this week. It's been an

educational experience. It's been fun. I've only been here for today, because I flew in from Boston early this morning. But it's been great having you, Brian. And unfortunately, you're not going back to Poland, because since you've been here, we are, as Americans say, two and O. And we've got no goals in, right? A clean sheet. Yeah. Yeah. I'm the good York charm. They you they you

need it. Yeah. And then, then, Richard Hickcoach says you can't go back. So for everyone out there, we talked about the same thing. Last week, but latent Orient is leap two. And you're trying to get promoted. And you had a six year plan. And you're in your five of the six year plan. I think, to be honest, it's yes, six. Okay. But you could say because

of however, however long you count COVID, you know, well that is also not, we can debate. Right. But you sit atop the standings right now. So. I know there's a long way to go this season, but right now, you're you're looking promising. Yeah. We right now, we have, what is it? 25 point. And yeah, 25 out of 27 points. So we're in good position. Very good

position. And our goal difference, which for the audience is if everyone's equal on points, they use goal. And we're going to be able to get a goal. The goal difference, which is goal scored minus goals, let's say, as the fact that the determines who goes up. So goal difference is important. Okay. Also for our audience who may have missed my interview in Nigel a couple of

years ago, you grew up a latent Orient fan. You came to the stadium with your family. And the team was in distress a few years ago. And the opportunity came up for you and a few others to purchase the team. Not everyone gets to purchase the team that they grew up loving and we're a fan of. But it comes with a lot of responsibility. I mean,

I've walked around with you today. And, you know, like I said, at last week's podcast, the fans here are at a next level. It's different than what I see in America. This is part of the fabric of their life. So a lot of pressure. It comes with being the chairman of latent Orient. Yeah. I think it's a first thing I'd like to start. Yes. Our first

came here. Where we're sitting now was where I first came. But with a different stand. Yeah. In 1959. I supported the club. There were 63 years to the 72. As you say, we had an owner who's named my car saying because we don't say anymore. Okay. And left. Club in in a terrible state. We were for those watching the Rexham series and the National League, which

is where Rexham are. And we managed to get promotion after two years. But when we bought the club. I was very fortunate that a gentleman who is my great friend and partner now can T came along and put up the majority of the financing at the time. And we've had a great partnership. We've had terrific ball members. Many of whom are American as well as British.

And we are on this six year journey. And at the moment, things are looking good. But as I've said, and Brian, you probably say there's like 20 times today. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. Right. We've only got 37 games to go to the end of the season. So it's nice to be four points clear. But it is a very long marathon. One of the reasons

I'm here in Europe is to differentiate between American sports and European sports. Last week with Martin, we talked about promotion and relegation. From the business standpoint, what does it mean if late and orient gets promoted up to league one? How does that impact the franchise? Okay. So the first thing I would say is in my 63 years, we've been just about everywhere. So just to run

through. So your listeners got a clear idea. From a historical perspective, how promotion and relegation works. So they changed the name of the leagues over time. But I'm going to use the modern terms. So when I came here in 1959 for the first time, we were in what's now called the championship. Three years later, we went up to the Premier League. We actually beat Manchester United

at home one nothing. Wow. And we did go up with Liverpool. And then we came down after one year. And then we say, we're going to go back to the league. We stayed in what was then called the championship, sorry, then called league two, but championship for a few years then went down to what is now league one. Stay there for some time went down to

league two. As it's called now, then back to league one. And then when the previous owner on the club, after being in league one for a long time, he took us down and beat the league two and two years later. And then we went down to the national league. So we've been up and down. And to ask you a question, effectively in the current financial situation,

if we go to the league one, it's probably wasn't about a million extra a year. And before that in the context, this year we're expecting to lose about one and a half million. Okay. And as I think I've said before, most clubs in the EFL, which is the three leagues below the Premier League, lose money. So, I think that's the promotion is important for us, but

that also has some higher cost for players and what have it. Right. Martin said last week that our budget is about 2.3. It's probably one of the higher ones in this league. If we go up to league one, it's probably four or five million. If we go up to the championship, it's probably in the range of 10 to 20 million. So, you know, players get paid

more as you go up. But we should also make more money. We get more fans to the games. And as you've seen personally today, more away fans is an important part of that. The team we played today probably bought 200. And because serious. And I know Americans find this somewhat odd separation between your way fans and the home fans. If the away section isn't sold out,

we can't fill it with home fans. So our way section holds 1300. There's probably 200 to 50. So we had over 1000 space seats that we couldn't sell. So you're marketing to away fans to or you're hoping they're going to show up. Yeah. Any tickets that aren't sold for the away section, you can't sell to your late Norean fans. Is that correct? That's correct. And one

of the things I think is interesting that Americans perhaps don't get about US soccer. And it was interesting. Someone showed me that I was going to be a little bit more interested in the game. And it was interesting to me in the middle of the week, a PNL for a championship club that someone was looking to buy. And it was interesting trying to explain to them

some of the differences. And the differences are firstly, you cannot sell alcohol in front of the pitch. And you saw yourself today, we bring down the blinds just before the game starts because you cannot be lifting a pipe and watch football at the same time. That all goes back to various events that happened in the 70s the latest. And I think that's the thing. There is

not the same propensity to turn up at the game early that you see in the States with tailgating. And one of the reasons is there's a lot of space around most grounds. Right. And then as the separation of the fans, which again goes back to some of the stadium disasters that we had in the 70s, eighties. And the safety laws as a result to avoid violence.

And going back to one of the disasters of major fire, our most more brutal here than they are in the Marathon. And that means that there's a lot of restrictions that keeps our PNL somewhat restricted. Yeah, I mean for my listeners. I didn't know this, but there is a section of the stadium here. It's literally segregated for the away fans. So the away fans and the

whole environment. There's like a wall up that prevents them from interacting. So you wouldn't see that in America. Whether it's a call it football game and NBA Game and supper game. There are fans of opposing teams that are sitting in the same areas. You're able to drink alcohol in the seating bowl, you know? Maybe they cut off sales after the third period, but you're able to

drink beer or alcohol in the seating bowl. That is not a job out here for the reasons that you just outlined. So when you get into the business of running a club over here, it's almost like the more successful you are, the more money you can make, but also the more expenses you have with your roster. And then you still have the restrictions of the ticket

sales to the away fans. If those don't sell out, then you have to eat those seats basically. And then also the alcohol sales. And for most franchises in America, the alcohol sales are a huge part of their bottom line. Well, it's interesting. I've done some comparisons to my one share that which clubs are which, but essentially club, this called a big franchise is in the States.

Okay. What's known as the cap rate in other words, the amount of stop. Like, phone, beverage, merchandise and sometimes things like car pocket in the States for big franchises, probably is 25 30 dollar mark. I was a USL, which is like the second tier of US Soccer game, the Saturday. And that's like 1920. And here is about four pounds. So huge difference. And it's the, a

lot of it is those restrictions that you felt out. Right. And I think we, as a guy, you're over here, need to focus on what we can do. Do I look like that? Because that's a lot, a lot of lost revenue, but the club all picking up. So how do you do that? I mean, do you get all of the owners of the soccer clubs and

all the different levels together and say, we're leaving a lot of money on the table or we need to put some security in place so we can sell alcohol in the seeing ball, but not have riots and fires and things of that nature. How do you fix that? Well, taking the alcohol one, there was a government report, which is set, see, came after several clubs, went

out of business, which I think in America will be perceived to be a gay or a club went out of business. But here, that's a lot of a major institution in the community. And I think you said on your podcast last week, week, when you were talking to Martin, the, the community identification with the club is so significant here. You know, very deep. And, and it's,

so that was one of the factors. And then we had this. So called super league that was talked about, so the government set up an inquiry. And that inquiry, as she said, I think we're going to have a lot of things. And I think that the fact that, for clubs at our level, which is league two, there should be a trial of alcohol again. The police

were dead against it. The police thought that was an awful idea. So it's unlikely to happen. And your point about getting together with the other clubs. I think one of the things that's actually very positive about football, soccer here is that people truly believe that they can work together I mean, we work with other clubs, you'd set with our opponents today. Everyone gets on absolutely fine.

Yeah. So I don't think it's a case of us getting together. It's basically controlled by legislation. And we need to influence politicians, all the police to make a change. Do you see that happening in the next five, 10 years or is that such an uphill battle? And is this such tradition here that it's going to be hard to change? I, I, I, I, I, I, I,

I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, that, I, op, I, I, I, op, I, I,

I, that, I, I, with the sweet areas, right, to drink. It's still watched the game. I mean, yeah, they're not going to suddenly run on the pitch from the right from that is sweet. So I think there needs to be some consideration. I think it is also ironic that a view against our current law is a lot of people go to the pub get, as we

say, tanked up, right, before they come to the stadium. And then at half time, people go and have a quick drink in 10 minutes, which is probably the fastest way I get in drunk, rather than having a slow, right, drink as you're watching. So I think it may change, but I think a much bigger issue is the whole issue of redistribution. And this is a very

complicated subject that's been bought to four by these clubs going out of business. And there is a view that there needs to be redistribution between the Premier League and the EFL, which is the championship league one and league two. And we as the EFL are pushing for 25% of the joint media rights. And I think progress will take place over that. And we're very well led

in the EFL. And I think this is going to be big news over the next probably six to nine months. English Premier League, they get lots of money for the sponsors on their kits. Is that equivalent at this level? I mean, I know it's not dollar for dollar equivalent, but when I'm looking at the revenue streams at this level, is that one of the main revenue

streams is the kits sponsorship. Well, kits sponsor ship and other sponsorship is a big opportunity. And we have been quite creative in the past. I mean, our front of shirts, fun stuff. Is actually Harry. And for those who don't know Harry Kane, and you should know Harry Kane is the England soccer captain. At the start of the pandemic, which was a very bad time for the

world, but also a bad time for football, because we had a carry on playing despite the pandemic. And we approach Harry Kane, who a long time ago at the start of his career came from Tottenham, Holtzburg, where he's always played to late Northern on loan. And he gracious. He's obviously agreed to sponsor us and is now done it for three years. And we have three kits

for different charities. And our first kit, our red kit, is shout, which is for mental health. We also have another kit for a big charity called the Tommy Club. And then we have one for a mental, for a hospice for children. So the Harry Kane has been incredibly gracious. We're very proud of our relationship with him. But I think the point is that I think over

time, this game is growing and growing. And I think you're going to see more access to the EFL across the world. We should bring more money into the game. And by the way, we're not just asking as an EFL to take more to take all the money from the Premier League. It's to join media. So we should be making more money as well. And the game

is going to be a lot more fun. Maybe it's the number one game in the world. And I think people love the idea of promotion, radiation, the drama that comes with it. And I think programs like Rexam are going to help everyone understand it and obviously your podcast as well. So I think the broadcasting will improve and I should help our economics. Yeah, I mean, you

told me, I don't know, a week ago on the phone that you thought because of Ted Lasso and welcome to Rexam that the value of the franchise is over here, have increased substantially. Yeah. Is that? Well, it's undoubtedly true. Because I think Americans keep coming in. I mean, right. I forgot now the American owners in the Premier League, but a lot. I mean, we played, take

me down a link to the wall. So they just got new American ownership. And ballmas, the latest club to rumors, that's not happened yet of American ownership. So I think it's attracting Americans in and they look at the cost of buying, clicking at the top level, a Premier League club against a NFL franchise or MLB or basketball or hockey. And think has great value here. Obviously,

also at the moment, with the pound dollar rate, you're effectively getting. Well, depends how you take the true exchange rate. I've always taken it to be about 160. We're down to about one 15. So you get a significant discount. So I think you'll continue to see a lot of American owners come here. And as you've experienced yourself, I think the site level driven by the promotion

of relegation is staggering. And I think that will also bring people in. Yeah. Media rates and streaming. Those are other. Revenue opportunities for clubs. Um, you know, our audience knows what this means in America. What does it mean over here? I know you just launched a streaming service and explained to our audience. You get to keep most of that revenue. I'm assuming. So that's a great

opportunity for your club. So. Soca is a pretty conservative business. And a lot of paper. People through the years of opposed any kind of TV rights. When I grew up, there was no football on TV. Um, and it's gradually become more prevalent, but it's still controlled. For reasons that are too complex to explain, we can't show three pop kickoff games. Life. Um, and the result is

now, and this was a big innovation about. Five years ago, the EFL came up with a streaming service. We sit when we're in the national league, which the league below, we actually had our own streaming service. So we were very enthusiastic about joining with the league. But we took their feed and then topped and tailed it by having a pre game show, which, by the way,

anywhere, can watch on YouTube. Um, half time show and opposed game show. So we kind of are trying to make it as close to broadcast quality. As we can. So we do all that ourselves. Um, every game is streamed on our website, latinore.com, quickblood, uh, 10 pounds a game. And we're graduating, increasing our number of overseas viewers. Um, we're excited about that. I think the broadcast

rights, as I mentioned earlier, for the EFL will continue to grow. Most of games in the States are shown on the ESPN plus. Um, but I think the, you know, the excitement of all these back. And I think the media rights will grow. You have an interesting perspective, because you live in London, and you live in America. You also know, as you alluded to earlier, owners

of American sports franchises. Does that joint perspective help you in both countries and especially as the chairman of latinore.com? Yeah, it does. So I mean, I truly think it does give me kind of a unique perspective. Um, I think with, I'm lucky that Boston is so close to London. There's, you know, I'm in Hobbauer's last night. Um, and I'm fortunate as you say, I've known a

lot of great owners. I mean, the craft, obviously, under patriots, uh, the red stuff, great organization. We've always been in help. And I think that's the most helpful to us. Um, I say, I now, I think I have a good perspective of how far you can push American ideas and how far you've gone. Um, I say it a lot of things are very different. I mean,

you said to me today, the access to the fans and the ownership is amazingly different. I mean, you walk amongst the supporters. They call them supporters here, not fans. You walk amongst the supporters. And I doked with you that under as an American, they're in their luxury box. They're going up and down the elevator. They're going between their car and the luxury box. They're not out

amongst the people very rarely. Um, so it is different here. You know, your shaken hands with people. People are coming up and giving you opinions, good or bad. And you're subjecting yourself to that when a lot of owners in America wouldn't do that. It's interesting. I mean, one of our bull members, one of the reasons we pull up the club is Kent T who, as I

said earlier, is a great friend and partner. He is the best of doing what I call management by walking around wishes, management phrasing the book in search of excellence. Um, Tom Peters and Walter. Um, and he walked around the ground. He walks into pubs, fans have asked him to come home for lunch, dinner, and he goes, wow. And, and I think one big difference for the

American supporters, the fans are part of our constituency. Right. I mean, when I was running Duncan, it was important to me to know the views of franchisees, but not just to represent it, the average franchisees. So I, I'd set up opportunities to meet all of those franchisees and we had like 2000. So I think the closeness of ownership to the fans is much, much stronger here.

And I think what comes with that is a certain amount of emotion, because this is a very emotional game. Yeah. And, and, and people have emotional opinions. And you just have to sometimes stand back from it all. And that is one benefit of living in the mirror of it. Yeah. I mean, you talk about segregation of the opposing friends from the home. Fans, I think in

America, the owners are segregated in large part from the supporters and the fans. And I think that actually cools is a problem because they, they aren't in tune with the fans. Think it. I mean, we have, again, I think you've got a surprise. We have free, fun podcasts. Right. And, and you sit down with the podcasts and your coach sits down with the podcast again in

America that doesn't typically happen. No. And there's, there's all to do with the media. Right. So no one's the game. But I mean, we're, we're considered to be a leader in that. I wouldn't say we're the absolute leader. We can always do better. But a major part of that report, the government group, Paul is effectively clubs here as seen as community. Yes. Yeah. And you heard

a fan say to me that I'm a temporary custodian of the club. And that is something I believe in. It's actually cost us a lot of money. Yeah. I'm pretty kidding. But you know, I see this as something that we're doing for the community of lighten on the, quite a, on the surrounding area. How has your experience with the big brands, Duncan and Baskin Robbins and

Abercrombie and, you know, the many brands that you've worked with blockbuster? How has that helped you in the position of chairman of late Norin? But I think the first thing I'd say, I think it's very important. You need to listen to your customer. And I think that's scared back to that. Disco, and we just had about fun. I think we could always find opportunities for more

revenue. So that's important. And you look into the numbers. I think I've learned over time. And we didn't always get it right that to have the right culture in the organising is critical. And we feel that I hate culture. You I think had a nice walk with it. Yeah. Richie, we got a guy who really engages with the players, engages with his coaches. And I think

that's important. And I think culture is perhaps someone said a management conference in New York to be as he cultures like the big buzzword. But it's so important. And I think that's a real learning. Yeah. And so I think that helps. I think that the way Americans look at finance is also somewhat different. We're very big on risks and opportunities of projecting forward with less focused

on history, gallery, writer history, look forward and project forward and how are you going to hit those targets. So I think that makes you slightly more aggressive in the way you look at things. And so I think it's helped me enormously. And I've very fortunate to have a great board. We've got a lot of experience. We've got McKinsey, consultant, Kent used to work at Microsoft. We've

got people who are entrepreneurs. We've got one guy who runs a major sports business. Professional dots. I've got my son who's on the board who works at Sky. So he's a leg for broadcasting. So we all got this expertise and it comes together. And and the question you have announced me by a large for it anyway. Would I do it all again? You bet fantastic. That's

great. Just a few minutes left. We just poked our heads in and walked about a half of the women's soccer club. And I think that's a great idea. This has been such an area of growth in America. The WNBA is growing. The NWSL. There's a lot of area for growth here. I mean, I will be candid and I said this to you off air. I think

from what I've seen here, it's a little bit behind America as far as the development and growth of women's sports. But that seems like another great area of growth potential here. No, we think so. I think it's interesting. The success I think a women's cricket is probably a leader. I think it's interesting. One of the car companies, which I thought are over which one. So I

won't leave it because I'll get it wrong. I had a very successful sponsorship of women's cricket. So women's football has been behind. I think it's come a long way. Five years. I think the lionesses, as they call, went in the euros to summer is going to cut the polter. Yeah. I'd late. We're in. We've got our women's team. Who, as you say, first time ever played

a double head of the same day as the met. And they played some beautiful football, both of what we saw. And then we've also got a new deal with Tottenham Hotspur women who played the women's suit super league. So they've played lots of their games. Yeah. We're going to get a hybrid pitch. As a result of that, we're hoping to attract some Tottenham fans to late-nourished

games. And hopefully so with our fans, we'll turn up to watch their game when they're here on a Sunday. So I think where we've got twin structures of pushing women's football forward. But I see the strength of women's sports in the States. And I think there is signs that it's beginning to break through here. Yeah. I've heard of one big game at the WSL that that.

It's not taking place for weeks where they've already sold 33,000 tickets. So I'm very optimistic about the future of women's sports. Yeah. Well, I gotta tell you, I'm impressed with your operation here. And the chemistry that your football staff has, that your business staff has. Even the game day operation. Do you walk around the stadium and everyone has a smile on their face and they shake

your hand and they're very welcoming. So I think you've got a lot of potential. So I think it's great that this is the team that you grew up with as a boy. So I'm sure you're invested in it in a way that you wouldn't be if this was just a spreadsheet purchase. And you didn't have that connection. But I can't tell you how much I appreciate

you welcoming me in the last week and letting me kind of poke my head onto the hood a little bit. And like I told you for our listeners, it was important to hear from the fans. The people who are actually making these decisions, a chairman like yourself or Martin who's building the roster instead of just asking the supporters what they think. So thank you so much

for having me here. Well, Brian, I think having you is actually helped us. But it gives us perspective on two of those very issues because you can never have enough insight in what perhaps you're missing. I mean, we're very close to it. Despite the fact that I say, I'm in books. I'm not that close, right. But to hide someone from outside coming here that is spending

time with us. Thank you for your investment in time. And one loves plug. If anyone wants to watch a late or it game, please go to lake.nory.com and stream it 10 pound ago. Well, I'll tell you this. A lot of people in America watched had lasso and they've adopted aFC Richmond as their team, even though they don't actually play games late. Noran is my adopted team

now. I'll be watching the games on the stream. I will be following the podcasts and watching from afar from America. So this is my team now. I'm invested. And you now know, not to take on our goalkeeper on a quiz lot. That is true. Yes. You have the smartest goalkeeper when it comes to trivia that I've ever seen. Nigel Travis, chairman of late and orient. Thank

you so much. Thank you, bro. This is episode of sports business radio is brought to you by underdog fantasy, the fastest growing fantasy app ever released and the official gaming partner of sports business radio. And with early investors like Mark Cuban, Kevin Durant, Adam Schaefter and Jared golf, I know that underdog fantasy is made for people like me who are on the go and want something

quick, easy and fun to play. And today we've got a special offer for sports business radio listeners. If you sign up to underdog fantasy using the program code SBR, they're going to double your first deposit up to $100. No risk, no long term commitment, just sign up using promo code SBR and your first deposit is matched up to $100 for free. I already played underdog fantasy

on the underdog fantasy app. But if I didn't, I'd use that for $100 and go for a pick them contest where I can bet the over under on individual players or team matchups. Or maybe the best ball mania three contest. And then the best worth $10 million in total prizes. All you have to do is draft a team for the season. No waivers, no lineups, no

injury reports. Underdog fantasy takes care of all of that for you. So do what I've been doing. Go to underdog fantasy. Download the app. Sign up with promo code SBR and get started right away with a free match on your first deposit up to $100. Well, that's it for this edition of sports business radio. Thanks for tuning in. Thanks to our team at sports business radio.

Brian Griggs, Josh Blank, Ryan Nakajima, and our friends at CG sports who power sports business radio. CG Young, Matt Amarlin, Nicole Wardle and Calvin Works. I'm Brian burger. Have a great week and we'll talk to you soon right here on sports business radio. This and every SBR podcast is available on Apple podcasts. Spotify, Stitcher and your favorite listening app. Follow sports business radio on Facebook, Twitter

at SBR radio. The Graham at sports business radio. And online at sportsbusinessradio.com. Sports business radio is produced by Brian Griggs and Griggs Productions. GriggsProductions.com.